why do animals die?

by doogie 22 Replies latest jw friends

  • FairMind
    FairMind

    Perhaps the reasons animals die is because God never intended them to live forever. After all, the Bible says man was created in God's image not animals. Think of the vast difference between animals an mankind! Man can think in the abstract, plan for the long-term future, write books and build on knowledge collected over many generations. Can animals do that? If man was not created with the potential of living forever then why is the brain designed is such a way that that it can acquire ever increasing knowledge for what appears to be an eternity of time?

    My belief based on observaion and thought is that animals were created by God to function exactly like they do in the wild. Some animals are carnivores, some are vicious predators. This may seem repugnant to us humans but it is the order of things as intended by God. We cannot change the nature of God's creation, it is not our right and it is not in our power. It is the heart of man that must be changed and that occurs on an individual basis only to those who want to change.

    I'd like to add that God is not one to be mocked or rediculed or blamed for the problems of the world. As important as we might think we are the universe could go on very well without us. God will make all things right in his due time, let's not get on his bad side.

    This is NOT a pro-JW post just a pro-God post.

    FM

  • doogie
    doogie
    As important as we might think we are the universe could go on very well without us.

    on the other hand, the universe seems to be progressing pretty nicely without god's influence (apparently) either.

  • gaiagirl
    gaiagirl

    Animals and humans die for the same reason, because their bodies wear out. Solomon is often said to be blessed with wisdom from Jehovah. In Eccl 3:19-21 he wrote "The fate of people and animals is the same, one dies just like the other. The all have the same breath, and people have no advantage over animals; its all just vanity. All go to the same place, all are made from the earth, and all return to the earth again. Who can say whether the spirit of a person ascends, or whether the spirit of an animal descends?

    I would agree with Solomon. I don't see a difference in KIND of intelligence between animals and people, just a difference in degree. We write books because we have hands with opposable thumbs, but out mental capabilities are just more complex examples of what other creatures do. Koko the gorilla cannot speak, because her larnyx is not constructed to make the same sounds we do. Still, she carries on conversations using ASL (American Sign Language), constructs sentences, and expresses love toward her keepers and her own pets. She once called another gorilla who had not learned ASL a "stupid monkey". Her conversational abilities have been compared to a human child about five years of age, perhaps due to the smaller capacity of her brain compared with a human.

    Conceivably, whales could learn to converse with humans, or humans could learn to converse with whales. Perhaps WE are too stupid to learn the whale language, which appears to consist of complex vocalizations which are learned and repeated to other whales.

    Creatures which we think of as "lower" life forms are primarily lower in the complexity of their brains and nervous systems. Yet even in these, they have a sense of self, they recognize themselves as different from others of the same species, and from the creatures they may need to eat, or to escape from.

    Anyone with an aquarium can watch how the fish behave when a new fish is added to the tank. Some fish are nervous about the newcomer, and shy away, as it may try to eat them. If this were merely instinct, then they would never get over it, yet when the new fish doesn't demonstrate aggressive behavior, they learn to tolerate its presence, even swimming right in front of or next to it. Others fish,(gouramis, for example), demonstrate curiosity, and will swim over to the newcomer and investigate it, touching it gently all over with their fins.

    On a recent PBS broadcast, a herd of hippos found a dead cow on the bank of a river. They gently licked the body, then arranged themselves around it in a protective ring, and stood vigil for hours. Were they having a funeral for the cow (not even one of their own species), or protecting the body from crocodiles? If they were just dumb animals, why would hippos even care if crocodiles ate the body?

    Elephants have been filmed caressing the bones of dead elephants which they had known in life. Does the living elephant remember who the bones belonged to?

    My own view is that the spirit or life force comes from the same place, regardless of the creature which contains it. When the physical body expires, the spirit returns to the same place.

  • badboy
    badboy

    Interesting that you should mention it because I have been told by one jw that animals like lions practise incest, animals were unaffected by the Fall so can practise incest.

    hope that helps.

  • zen nudist
    zen nudist

    someone already made a point like this in another thread

    the bible does not indicated in any way shape or form that man was originally designed to live forever...

    it says that the only reason man did end up dying was due to NATURAL old age, not artificially enhanced by something called the tree of life....

    the bible is very misleading if not out right lying to claim that death came because of sin.... when the bible shows clearly that it was

    the loss of un-natural immortality which was lost because of dis-obeying a warning which turned out to be a lie.

  • doogie
    doogie
    the loss of un-natural immortality which was lost because of dis-obeying a warning which turned out to be a lie.

    ah...now it all makes sense...

    ...it all makes sense that the bible is complete crap. man, i'm going to sleep peacefully tonight.

    "And the world might cease
    if we fail to tame the beast
    from the faith that you release
    comes an atheist peace." -- Bad Religion

  • Nosferatu
    Nosferatu

    The animals shouldn't have been peeing on and pooping under the tree of knowledge.

  • doogie
    doogie
    shouldn't have been peeing on and pooping under the tree of knowledge.

    haha! bad dog!

  • Balsam
    Balsam

    This is what I think:

    First of all there is little difference between humans and animals from the standpoint of flesh. Oh we might think and be a bit more advanced because of language and thought. But our brain is the only difference and the fact that evolution has caused us to be able to reason. Who knows perhaps one day a planet of the apes will happen. LOL Wouldn't that be a hoot. Guerilla have a 98% simularity to human DNA, did you know that? As for being of the flesh and the flesh being temporary, we all die some day no matter how smart we may think we are. So far we have no proof of what happens to us after death. Some like to believe we continue on through an invisible soul, some don't believe that. I think there is no sin, no redemption, no savior for us or anyone. As far as a god creating us? Well in my book the jury is still out on that one. But I am open to discussion on it. Personally I don't believe the bible is divinely inspired anymore. It is a book written by men for men to try to grasp why we exist. The bible proclaims it inspired, but has no evidence it is. Once the bible is eliminated from the equation, it all seems a lot simpler I think. But that is me, and everyone has their own opinion and that is ok with me unless they try to force it on me.

    So before all you god fearing ones start jumping on me like a pack, remember your Christians and think of how Jesus would have responded. LOL So if your uncomfortable with what I said just pretend you didn't read it and move on.

    Balsam

    Balsam

  • doogie
    doogie
    So before all you god fearing ones start jumping on me like a pack, remember your Christians and think of how Jesus would have responded. LOL So if your uncomfortable with what I said just pretend you didn't read it and move on.

    i think anyone too stuck on the bible probably stopped reading this thread a long time ago.

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