Feral elders

by SixofNine 51 Replies latest jw friends

  • SixofNine
    SixofNine

    Came to my door this morning. Seems they want to clean up the books or somesuch. They said that they had some serious "accusations" against me, and would be having an elders meeting (...."uh..uh...it's a judicial meeting" ) this wednesday evening. I gave them a slight but understanding grin. They hinted at me giving them a statement of dissasociation a couple of times in the conversation. They made the requisit posturing towards spirituality; that they could "help" me (what are their qualifications again?) if my faith has been shattered, hinted that things have changed for the better in the congregation (well, the one who knows me did, the "new" guy, whose only been in the congregation 2 years, while I've been gone for over 4, was pretty much "let's just get this done" in his tone).

    The timing of this sucks; my sister is getting married the first weekend in Sept. The wedding is at my other sister's house, immediate family only, so this will likely not be a huge problem, but who knows? It could turn into one. One of the nicest things about my fade is that my sister (and nieces) who have a nice circle of friends, has been able to walk the edge and have family/social events that include me, and still have her witness friends come too. Guess who will likely lose in this scenario in the future, if I am df'd or even da'd?

    I'm suspicious of their claim to have serious accusations against me, as I tend to think they are just trying to clear the *Six* problem up; but who knows? I've run across witnesses alone and in groups about 3 times recently, and while the meetings were all very friendly reunions, I think also that it might have gotten people talking about me, and thereby spurred the feral elders into action?

    Well, any strategy ideas? I'm curious about the what and who of the charges, but not curious enough to go into the meeting and debate any charges against me. Nor do I feel like "reasoning from the scriptures" with these clowns, as that is not my forte, and they don't reason anyway, especially not in groups.

    It looks to me like one of two things will happen:
    a) They will disfellowship me (most likely)
    b) They will dissasociate me (less likely unless I do it for them)

    I'm thinking the best course to minimize the impact on my family, is to go ahead and dissasociate. It may screw my chances of helping any of my old acquaintances, but I think the family will for the most part just *yawn* and say "we knew that". Anyway, I'd send out a note to all of them letting them know it was under duress, and that I would have preferred to just fade away.

    I just had a thought, what if I were to give them a letter stating that I voted in the democratic primary, and intend to excercise my right to vote in all upcoming elections. I wonder how they would feel they needed to handle that legally? Voting is a bit of a tricky area for them legally.

    Or maybe Kim Norris would like to get some adversarial practice in Wed. evening? Kim? Kim? heellpppp meeeee ....I'm drowningggg... lol.

  • Lady Lee
    Lady Lee

    My advice based on reading how others have dealt with this

    threaten to sue them personally if any announcment is made

    The Best of... WTS and Judicial Committees

    Go. Read. and Learn

  • candidlynuts
    candidlynuts

    first question i'd ask is if the CO is visiting.. thats the only time the elders from my former hall ever called.

    i'd respectfully decline to meet till sept after the wedding. they love to ruin weddings. dont give them the ammunition to do it.

  • simplesally
    simplesally

    Why do either one? Df'ing is not your choice and your family will see it that way.........da'ing is your choice and they will see it that way too.

  • SixofNine
    SixofNine
    i'd respectfully decline to meet till sept after the wedding.

    Perhaps I wasn't clear; the judicial meeting will be held this wednesday evening whether I attend or not.

    Why do either one? Df'ing is not your choice and your family will see it that way.........da'ing is your choice and they will see it that way too.

    Actually, I think my family realizes that my choice is not to be a JW. Df'ing puts them in a more awkward position mentally, I believe. "True, he was da'd, but he had really long before ceased to be a JW" is easier for them to rationalize than "He's df'd".

  • Satanus
    Satanus

    Perhaps suggesting that you could only meet to discuss serious acusations if you had your lawyer present. I mean, they are serious, aren't they? Or, are they just frivolous? If frivolous, then why the fuss?

    Just a thought.

    S

  • DanTheMan
    DanTheMan

    Did you commit to Wednesday night?

  • Scully
    Scully

    Sixy:

    Well, any strategy ideas? I'm curious about the what and who of the charges, but not curious enough to go into the meeting and debate any charges against me. Nor do I feel like "reasoning from the scriptures" with these clowns, as that is not my forte, and they don't reason anyway, especially not in groups.

    It looks to me like one of two things will happen:
    a) They will disfellowship me (most likely)
    b) They will dissasociate me (less likely unless I do it for them)

    I'm thinking the best course to minimize the impact on my family, is to go ahead and dissasociate. It may screw my chances of helping any of my old acquaintances, but I think the family will for the most part just *yawn* and say "we knew that". Anyway, I'd send out a note to all of them letting them know it was under duress, and that I would have preferred to just fade away.

    Were there "two eyewitnesses" to the behaviour that brought about the serious accusations against you?? Or do you think they may just be on a fishing expedition?

    You can't confirm or deny anything unless they tell you what charges they have against you. They aren't supposed to DF someone unless they disclose the charges and give the person an opportunity to confirm or deny or defend themselves.

    Why not go to the Quotes website and D/L the Pay Attention book and read up on the procedural information regarding judicial committee meetings. I believe the book says that the accused is permitted to have someone in attendance for moral support. You can deny any charges against you (hey it seems to work for child molesters... ) particularly if this is a fishing trip or on the word of one person or people spreading malicious slanderous rumours and gossip. If you really want to get them going, you can deny the accusations as being "complete and utter lies and fabrications" and say that you are accusing your accuser of slander and that you expect them to follow up on it, and that such people have no place in Jehovah's Organization? and that's a huge part of the reason why you are inactive.

    I know it's not much comfort, but they will do what they want to do in the end. Just don't submit a letter of disassociation. When they make an announcement to that effect at the KH, everyone will assume that you've written a letter, and you can counter that with a true statement that you did NOT submit a letter of disassociation, and that the elders lied about it from the platform. There won't be any letter for them to produce to prove that you willingly DAd either.

    It makes JWs very uncomfortable when you get all upset and go on about "Why would the elders lie about me like that to the congregation?? I am so STUMBLED!! The Devil is supposed to operate in a deceitful way, but these people say they are God's Organization!! How on earth could this happen?? How can I show my face to my friends anymore??" You get the idea. It worked well when I used it.

    Love, Scully

    PS: Oh yeah, if you do go on Wednesday night, make sure you get everything on tape. heh heh

  • cruzanheart
    cruzanheart

    I'd write a letter, hand delivered by a service (so you have the receipt of delivery -- you don't have time for certified mail), stating that you will be out of town on Wednesday and unable to attend the judicial committee but since "serious" allegations of misconduct have been mentioned you reserve the right to be present and demand that they reschedule the meeting at a time that is more suitable for your schedule. Explain that your job takes you out of town frequently. Then schedule it for after the wedding.

    Make sure you send a copy to the Society -- that scares the pants off them. Be polite and ever-so-eager to clear up this awful misunderstanding.

    And good luck. (Elder #1 wasn't GT, was it?)

    Nina

  • Mulan
    Mulan

    I agree with Scully. Don't write a letter. That is what they want.

    Several years ago the local cong. df'd my cousin. She declined to go to the hearing, and they df'd her. Slam dunk. It wasn't what she wanted, and she told them she had done nothing wrong, so they had no reason to meet with her, but they disagreed. She felt by not going, they couldn't do anything to her. She was wrong. If she had attended, and defended herself, lied a little, it wouldn't have happened.

    Just my 2 cents.

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