EVIL LOUTION? Why do you still resist? Science doesn't work?

by Terry 95 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  El blanko

  I don't see how anyone can argue with that, at least on a micro-evolutionary level. This is an invisible change in the plant's genes, but it does mean that an entirely new species now exists, that didn't exist a couple of centuries back. It's fascinating stuff! And it never fails to get Creationists excited

  Hehe - bogus dude.

  They are both plants and according to 'their' kind are allowed to mutate using the rules of the creationist.

  Go and mate with a female ape and see what happens. I suggest you could do that for an eternity and nothing remarkable is going to happen, except your arm will be pulled out of it's socket each time (most likely).

  Must try harder Mr Tower.
• 

  Been there

  I believe in "Creative Evolution".

  I believe the body and nature are too well thought out and marvelous to have just happened. Some higher power put some serious thinking into it all. There is a place for everything and everything in it's place (usually). If you think about it...when you watch a baby grow from a sperm and an egg, into an adult, that is evolution speeded up. If we mere mortals can put two cells together in a dish and make a human start to grow, I think God could. I also know the earth has proven to be here much longer then 6000 years, no getting around it. As a baby grows so does the human race. I think we are in our early teens right now in history (evolution).
• 

  troll

  Well there was a global flood, or deluge as it is otherwise known. It has been documented by various religions and historical documents.
• 

  funkyderek

  Well there was a global flood, or deluge as it is otherwise known. It has been documented by various religions and historical documents.

  Troll? Hehe, at least you're honest. I am, of course, in camp 1. I despair that there is a camp 2, but at least I live in Europe where they're very rare.
• 

  googlemagoogle

  troll, you are so right. it has also been documented by various religions and historical documents, that earth is flat, and the sun moves around earth. and little trolls living in scandinavia. i don't get why noone believes it, when there's such great evidence!
  
  I am, of course, in camp 1. I despair that there is a camp 2, but at least I live in Europe where they're very rare.
  
  well, living in europe too, i consider both evolution and creation equally. in other words: both camps have their arguments, both may be right and both may be wrong. and: they are not the only existing "camps".
• 

  funkyderek

  well, living in europe too, i consider both evolution and creation equally. in other words: both camps have their arguments, both may be right and both may be wrong. and: they are not the only existing "camps".

  OK, here are the main "camps" as I see them

  1. Evolution occurs

  a. It works by completely natural processes

  b. Some supernatural force or entity was/is involved.

  2. Evolution does not occur.

  Obviously the groups can be further subdivided but I think everybody's covered by what's there. Now, anybody in camp 2 is wrong. They're quite simply, absolutely, totally and completely, laughably wrong. Evolution does occur and has been directly observed. There is an abundance of overwhelming and undeniable genetic and fossil evidence for this. In the civilised modern world, it's not in doubt at all.

  I am in camp 1a. I do not see anything in evolution that cannot be explained by natural means, nor do I see the point in a creator who would use such a method to create. Evolution seems to occur primarily - or totally - by natural selection and this seems a pointless and barbaric way to design.

  Many of those in camp 1b are there because there is something about the process of evolution (or abiogenesis) which they believe cannot be explained by natural means. Others are there because they believe in gods for some other reason.
• 

  Sirona

  Derek

  I agree with your last post. I'm in camp 1b then.

  I do not see anything in evolution that cannot be explained by natural means, nor do I see the point in a creator who would use such a method to create. Evolution seems to occur primarily - or totally - by natural selection and this seems a pointless and barbaric way to design.

  Perhaps God isn't consciously creating by means of evolution. Maybe it is simply a process that "God" is involved in, as we all are. People also seem to assume that if something is barbaric then God cannot be involved. IMHO death, pain and destruction are as necessary as the nice things like love and creation.

  Sirona
• 

  Pole

  Funky Derek,

  I am in camp 1a. I do not see anything in evolution that cannot be explained by natural means, nor do I see the point in a creator who would use such a method to create. Evolution seems to occur primarily - or totally - by natural selection and this seems a pointless and barbaric way to design.

  You seem to know a lot more than some of the brightest minds of the world.

  I thought you might give me one example of a coherent theory which explains how human language has evolved so far and which theory cannot be described with your 5 adverbs + one adjective combination: "simply, absolutely, totally and completely, laughably wrong".

  I don't want you to explain the details of the theory. Just give me the names of the linguists/evolutionists who've come up with an exlpanation of how language has been becoming gradually more complex, and whose arguments are not based on a bunch of "laughably" hypothetical premises.

  I'll do my own research if you give me this pointer. Surprise me!

  Thanks in advance.

  Pole
• 

  confusedjw

  Just refuse to accept the evolution theory because..........?

  Can't get past how a human baby has minutes for it's heart to seal up before it dies - how could that have been accomplished with evolution?

  Of course I also once saw the white tiger show in Reno and they swapped a woman and a tiger that were in cages on skinny poles up in the air - can't figure that out either and I don't believe in magic.
• 

  metatron

  I believe that the universe is pervaded with distributed intelligence - pantheism such as Spinoza and Einstein and Dyson

  thought.

  I challenge anyone visiting Bethel to also go to the Natural History Museum in NYC and take a good look at Neanderthal

  skeletons - such as "Turkana boy" and then tell themselves that humans haven't evolved.

  That said, I believe that current evolutionary theories are utter nonsense - and that critics like Rupert Sheldrake are simply

  ignored or shouted down.

  In particular, science is being led by a silly notion of genetic code being an all powerful "landfill" of determinants.

  Got musical talent? Got intelligence? Got a weird disease that only shows up in forty years? Are you gay?

  It just gets sillier and sillier - while the folks at Celera ( human genome project) clearly stated that the human

  genetic code is NOT "a blueprint"!

  We are running out of reductionism here, trying to lump every human trait and ability to a very limited - and "junk"

  filled code. A whole new - and radical - paradigm must emerge - either one that accepts non-local influences on life

  or a simple admission of defeat in reductionist ideology. Look for more biologists to toss words like "emergent"

  around.

  One of the wisest comments on this was uttered about a hundred years ago by a Hindu philosopher named

  Vivekananda , who questioned how the entire complexity of a human could be reduced to a small part of

  a cell ( long before DNA was discovered). His point still stands the test of time.

  metatron