by DreamMaster 51 Replies latest social relationships
Hi DreamMaster,
Yes, this stuff is real. I have a female friend who confides in me. Her current affair (shes married) started in chat rooms, then cyber-sex.....now ACTUAL visits.
It is very dangerous to any relationship. I think you both should STOP getting your jollies off on the Net (porn included) and seek counseling if you truly desire to save our marriage.
That said, maybe its just me, but porn (photos or movies) just DONT do for me.
Boozy
It's real.
But it's not.
You two are in a big grey area.
She's right that it is like when you look at pictures of women.
You are right that it is not (exactly) like that.
She is right that "that's what you're here for" (a sex rush while online/viewing pics).
You're right that she could meet up with this guy.
All the other people are right that these thing do tend to move on to real life sex. (kinda like the ole wts said about holding hands; technically they were right)
She talks to, and fantasizes about, another person doing sexual things to her.
You look at, and fantasize about, another person doing sexual things to you.
I think you two have a tuff road ahead, but maybe it is just the road that, realistically, every couple in this modern age is going to have to face. You are going to have to figure out exactly what level of sexual "loyalty*" (for lack of a better word) you are going to agree to in your relationship.
When you turned to porn, that is a step away from most** peoples view of absolute sexual "loyalty" to their marriage mate. Yet many people consider that the norm for married men. You may argue that it is morally ok, or that she knew that about it all along. What you can not argue is that your looking at porn is absolute sexual loyalty to her.
It may be that you two will disagree about how to solve this. She may just want you to get comfortable with it. You have to solve it, one way or the other. Obviously you can't go through life keyed up about this all the time. Well, I suppose you could, but that is not life, that is hell.
She may have been fine to just decide on absolute sexual loyalty before she tried this. She may feel differently now.
As Janh said, "Any woman thinking a man -- any man -- goes through life thinking of sex with her only is seriously deluding herself". And vice versa. So "absolute sexual loyalty" is a pipe dream anyway. Which means one has to at least negotiate from the knowledge that sexual thoughts about other people will at least be part of your partners sexuality.
Me thinks your problems go way deeper than sex. I'd say get some help in the form of a dispasionate 3rd party family counselor. You guys are definitely going to need a referee for this game.
*fidelity seemed to easy to split hairs about
**guess I can't really speak for most. maybe most witnesses?
Whoooaaa there Jan,
We were discussing not my life, but someone elses. Jealousy has nothing to do with what I wrote. It has to do with the self esteem, or rather lack of, that Dream Master's wife has.
If 'she' lacks confidence....his behavior would not help and the same for his wife. Her behavior does not help his self esteem.
And yes, if I had a husband with his nose to a computer screen hanging around pornographic sites I would not wish to be in a marriage like that.
Call it jealousy, Jan.....or is it morals????? Whatever it is, it is what it is to you only in "your" opinion. And the same applies to myself.
Your use of the english language is a marvelous example of a lack of morals in a public place.
My husband can look at any woman he likes....everyone can window shop......internet pornography is a little seedy IMHO and not far removed from cyber sex.
Btw, Jan...I wouldn't marry a man who engaged in internet porn in the first place.
Kind Regards,
Ana
ladonna,
Call it jealousy, Jan.....or is it morals?????
Jealousy.
I see no evidence that Dream Master's wife has any lack of self esteem. I see lots that he has, probably for good reasons!
Btw, Jan...I wouldn't marry a man who engaged in internet porn in the first place.
It is mostly like masturbation. When asked, 95% say they do it, and 5% lie. If the wife asks, the reponse is somewhat differently. What you get with such a principle, is a husband who is either impotent or dishonest. Your choice.
- Jan
--
Faith, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel. [Ambrose Bierce, The Devil´s Dictionary, 1911]
DreamMaster,
It seems to me that you both are spending time online that takes away from your relationship with each other. Wouldn't it be better to make each other's fantasies come true IN PERSON ?
DreamMaster,
welcome to the board. sorry to hear about the issues you are facing in your marriage. but a few things you said in your post made me cringe as i read it...
thanks to the wonderful feature "message archive" found in Yahoo Messenger, I found more than one EXTREMELY SEXUAL conversations with another man.
in a perfect world, of course, our mates would always fulfull our sexual desires but it doesn't always work that way. seems to me, some guys have a hard time remembering their wives/girlfriends are seperate people, with different thoughts and have the right to keep secrets.
I knew then I had no more access to her messenger archives(previous conversations). That's when I exploded. I confronted her about the cybersex she was having and demanded an explanation.
She tells me it's no different than when I look at nude pictures on the net. That's what you're here for. Can you compare mutually exchanging ideas and dialogue to the point of extasy to looking at a picture.
again, i am sorry you are going thru this, never fun fighting....but i think you have two choices, trust your wife or leave your wife. if you can't trust her, then you will just end up making both your lives miserable.
harmony
"Power doesn't mean you're acting like a man, or you're a bully or a bitch. It's that you don't let people step on you"
-Sharon Monplaisir
Well said, Harmony.
I am a bit astonished that more people don't react to this blatant violation of privacy. DreamMaster violated not only his wife's, but that of everyone she ever communicated with.
It is not unheard that I communicate with my friends (here and abroad, men and women) using IM services. And some of the stuff we talk about is clearly private. It may have to do with health issues, work, personal comments about others, whatever. I'd hate a nosy and jealous wife (or husband) reading my private statements just because they were looking for evidence of their spouse's infidility.
While I can understand that DreamMaster feels betrayed by his wife's cybersex, I personally see what he has done to her as the worst treachery of trust imaginable, and also a violation of the privacy of all his wife's contacts.
- Jan
--
Faith, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel. [Ambrose Bierce, The Devil´s Dictionary, 1911]
DreamMaster,
CyberSex: Real or Fantasy!
Fantasy.
Your wife obviously knows how much it bothers you, so she should consider your feelings about it. Some couples have no problems with it, because it's not real. It's 2 people fantasizing together.
That's my 2 cents.
peace,
somebody
Hi, DreamMaster.
Nobody on this board is going to be able to help you with this. We don't have enough background, and we can't get it by chatting about it this way, and it's questionable whether any of us could give you valuable guidance as to what to do even if we did have the background. We can't speak to your wife to hear her side of it so as to get an unbiased and well-rounded view of the whole situation.
There is definitely something wrong in your marriage. As you noted, it is probably on the line over this. If you want to save it, then hurry to a marriage counselor. Don't go to a minister or anybody connected with a religion. Just get a secular, trained, educated marriage counselor. Try to get your wife to see this person, too.
Hope it turns out best for both of you.
COMF
The problem is when you think of marriage as an institution created by some GOD. Marriage is an institution that controls male agression and gives females a haven for rearing the young. Beyond that... you write your own rules. Men treat women as sex objects. Women treat men as success objects. Men look at porno when an available female isn't around. Women read romance novels. Cyber-sex is "sex" only by definition. It is rather pharasaical to keep moving the boundary back to prevent "sin". Everything you attach the word sex to is not necessarily "sex".
JW's drive their young people into "sex" by messing with the definition. By calling "petting" loose conduct and requiring confession to the elders they drive people to the next step which really is "sex". If I am going to have to confess, you'd better believe it's going to have to be worth it.
Marriage IS a recipe for boredom - for many - but not for ALL. Since we really are just animals - there probably is NOTHING in life as engaging and exciting as the pursuit of a new sexual partner. However, men are extremely aggressive and disruptive when they are on the chase. Soceity is built on the back of boredom. We have great buildings, technology, music, because men are bored.
