I went to see my Dr about the blood card issue (page 2)

sir82

So far it is UK only, although one poster indicated it was coming to the US sometime soon.

Although the thing about "end of life" decisions has already been on the US cards for at least a decade.

Diogenesister

Thank you goneawol for your post, THIS IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT FOR ALL UK EXJW'S TO BE AWARE OF.

I am a nurse and currently a law student ( doing my LLB).

To take this further, it is true, would expose purrpurr.

My fear is that a nieve SHO in casualty, say following an accident, as you correctly say with this card may allow elders to gain access to immediate care records - which would include a fluid intake or IV chart/blood chart.

Also, unfortunately many dubs do hand over power of attorney to the elders.

These cards have to be stopped. I cannot believe they are legal given the potential to use them for punishment or as a tool to pressurize dubs into conformity on pain of loosing family members. I am so Keen for this to be challenged in the UK courts. It would require someone's who was prepared to go " public" unfortunately, at least to some extent.

Fantastic chat purrpurr...congrats for your courage and for bringing this out into the open.

DATA-DOG

Let me make sure that I'm understanding you. You are going to sign the "death warrant", but if you are ever in an accident, unconscious and need a transfusion, the Doctors will know to ignore the "death warrant" because they will see the alert on file?

Also, Old Hippie is technically correct. Although it's impossible for a Dub to have something done "against their wishes", because they don't know what they wish. They have been kept ignorant to the point that informed consent is non-existent. They don't realize that other "wishes" exist.

DD

purrpurr

Data-dog, I'm going to try like alot of people here to resist signing this blood card, but we know the kind of pressure the elders and family members can bring to bear. It's possible that they may either threaten or make life unbearable if I don't sign.

I agree this needs to be challenged but then what would the Watchtower say? " we didn't force them they had a choice (!) Loose your family or sign the blood card"

defender of truth

Well done, Purrpurr. I'm amazed by how you handled that. :)

"forcing people to sign this thing against their own wishes"

OldHippie: That is not exactly true, is it? I have not signed a card in my whole life, and nobody has objected or commented.
Sir89: "Coerced" is probably the better term.

I agree with Sir89. Coercion, not forced.

Bear in mind though, OldHippie, there is going to be a different situation for each Witness.

Some Secretaries will chase up any in there group who haven't given them a copy of this new document. Especially if you are unlucky enough to have the Secretary as your group's elder!!

Imagine, they pass you the form, and weeks later you haven't given them a signed copy to go in the congregation file... Don't tell me they wouldn't notice. :(

Finally, how much freedom do people living at home have to make this decision?

In my case, as a born-in, as soon as I was old enough to sign it, my parents and grandparents basically gave me the form, said I needed two witnesses at the next meeting to watch me sign it, then watched me do it and checked over the form to see I had filled it in correctly. (you may now have more of an idea of what my family is like.)

Congregations and families, in many cases, are very close-knit.

Social pressure is extraordinary in this religion.

Experiences will vary, but young adults living at home will have little say in this. Unless they want to risk major fights or getting reported to elders, many people living at home will be pressured to sign it, whereas they may have never got around to it before or not bothered to update it every few years.

Remember, there is no justification in a Jw's mind for not having one, to not have one is like toying with disobeying God and losing out on everlasting life.

p.s. Just remembered, my family even bought me a highly visible see through keyring with my card in it, and told me I should wear it all times on my house keys.

Depending on how caring/controlling one's congregation or family is, some will be coerced...

It is this arrangement where the elders hand them out to everyone in their group, and the announced reminder of giving copies to those who witness you signing it, that bothers me.

Also, each secretary will be fully aware of who has the new card, congregations are not that big. (at least here in the UK.)

I hope that some can slip through the cracks without getting unwanted attention.

Or do what PurrPurr did. ;)

konceptual99

I have NEVER lodged a card copy with the congregation and NEVER been asked to do so.

besty

I think I stopped signing them about 10 years before I left, which in itself is close to 10 years ago now.

I think you can reasonably stall by saying you aren't signing something you don't understand. Make a few appointments to have it explained to you, cancel them beforehand, re-book etc and eventually they will leave it. If push comes to shove delay further by saying you are going to discuss with your doctor, lawyer etc.

konceptual99

From the other thread....

Don't panic Captain Mainwaring. The Elders and HLC only have the power over you that you give them. Don't sign it. Don't talk to the elders about it. If they chase you at all it will be once or twice. Just tell them you'll sort it out. They will forget about it. Without this document the HLC can do bugger all.
It's not a bad idea to make your wishes clear in a document and conversation with your doctor but most elders don't have the time or inclination to keep track of who and who has not logged a blood card with them. Not only that but the fact the document is limited to so called primary components means loads of questions from old sisters about what they can and can't have. The elders will be glad of not being hassled by you
Remember as well this is only a document for the UK. Wording and mileage may differ elsewhere.

pale.emperor

I forgot to add, she said that in her experience jw's were very racist. I agreed and added that they were also homophobic and sexist.

I have to disagree with you there. Very racist? How exactly? I've not seen racism even once in the organization and I've been in 31years.

Homophobic? It certainly calls homosexuality a sin, but then so do many other religions. There's a homosexual baptized member in my hall and he's treated the same as everyone else.

Sexist? Again, many religions and a male only clergy etc. and have their reasons.

MarkofCane

I have never been forced or coerced to sign a death card ever. But if they implement this new rule where they want a card on file for each member as indicated in another post it could out faders who are not ready to come out. In my case, I will tell them I will not be signing anything regarding my medical records unless your my physician which you clearly are not. That's kind of end of discussion.

Now If your in good standing going to all the meeting, field service and participating in the school then you have created a conundrum for yourself. In there minds you are their slave still and need to comply. I have indicated by my absence that their rules are unimportant and I will not comply. I'm not df or da, most shun me and I shun them. I do believe I have made it perfectly clear where I stand without really saying a word.

The Only power they have is the power you bestow upon them.

I went to see my Dr about the blood card issue

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