lmao doc....your right...it makes no 'sens'...:P
Why does God create abominations?
by CPiolo 44 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
-
-
Insomniac
For what it's worth, I used to have a gay cat. I'm not joking, this is serious. Tut showed no interest in female cats, not even when they were in heat and practically ravishing him. However, he had sex on a regular basis with a younger male cat. The other cat (New Moon) put up with it, but has never shown any sexual interest in other male cats.
So, I'm thinking it's not a learned behavior, just how my kitties were born. Tut was gay, and could not be convinced to go straight. New Moon is straight, and could not be turned gay. For the record, I loved them both equally, fed them the same food, etc. The vet told me that a small percentage of animals are gay, and seem to be so from their kitten/puppyhoods.
I tend to think of homosexuality in humans the same way-neither a good thing nor a bad thing, just one more facet of our individuality. Only, humans have turned it into some big, moral issue, like we actually have a choice what gender we respond to. Like it even matters, people! I can't imagine that God would be so petty as to care if her children are straight or gay, so why do we?
-
A Paduan
It's a spiritual teaching - in relation to spiritual effeminancy - eg. jws
I would think that they are the very ideal of wickedness that they continually accuse others of being - eg. homosexuals.
-
Abaddon
But how can this be? Why would God create such deviant creatures? Why would God create people that are to be the object of God?s own wrath, to be the object of the bigotry, hate and abuse of ?good? and ?moral? people who have God?s good grace? Can someone please explain this to me? I certainly don?t understand it.
Maybe you just believe a story, that, like many old stories, when compared to reality, fails to fit.
Maybe if Jesus had been a Greek of the classical period, Chritianity would be a religion where women had even less rights than they do in literalists' Biblical Christianity, and where homosexual dalliance of older men with younger boys was considered a good thing?
Maybe we are not reading god's words, but the thoughts of a man shaped by his culture.
If you view things this way, then it's very easy to understand; either the Bible is just a book, or God has a very sick sense of humour.
-
CPiolo
Phantom:
My questions were somewhat rhetorical, but at the same time I would like someone with the mindset that any sexual behavior other than heterosexual behavior is somehow an abomination in the eyes of God to explain this when the evidence and data keep mounting that it is nature (read God) not nurture that determines one's sexuality and gender identity.
SF Jim:
Opinions and assholes -- we all have them and they often stink!
Abaddon:
I think you fail to understand that I don't take the point of view that such behavior is an abomination. I want someone who does have that point of view to explain why God creates something that they believe God abhors.
-------------
Many here seem to focusing exclusively on homosexuals, but sexuality is a continuum not a duality (heterosexual vs. homosexual) and there are many shades of gray in between. There are also transgendered individuals -- those who feel they've been born into the wrong body, i.e. a man in a woman's body and visa versa. Some of these people have surgery to correct what they feel has been a mistake -- transsexuals. These people may be of various sexual orientations as well -- homosexual, bisexual, heterosexual, etc.
The saddest part, IMHO, is that we as a species seem so quick to judge, but so slow to try to understand and show some compassion for those who are different in some way, not just sexually, but including race, religion, nationality, ethnicity and whatever minutia we decide to focus on.
Exclusivist/elitist religions are large contributers to the problem, again IMHO. -
SanFranciscoJim
It's a spiritual teaching - in relation to spiritual effeminancy - eg. jws
I would think that they are the very ideal of wickedness that they continually accuse others of being - eg. homosexuals.
Very good, A Paduan. In 1 Cor. 6:9-11, a scripture commonly used to condemn homosexuals, the Greek malakoi appears in this passage. In some English (mis)translations, malakoi is translated as "effeminate". In other (mis)translations, this word is translated as "homosexuals", "sodomites", or "men kept for unnatural purposes".
In actuality, the Greek malakoi literally translates as "limp", or "soft". When used in context with the remainder of the referenced passage, the correct meaning is rendered "spineless" or "cowardly".
Translation of the word malakoi into words of homosexual meaning shows clearly that there was a biased correlation with "limp"(-wristed) and stereotypically "soft" men, i.e., effeminate males. Because of this bias, it was assumed that Paul's words were a condemnation of homosexuals, when in fact Paul was actually condemning cowardice.
-
JamesThomas
But how can this be? Why would God create such deviant creatures? Why would God create people that are to be the object of God?s own wrath, to be the object of the bigotry, hate and abuse of ?good? and ?moral? people who have God?s good grace?
Can someone please explain this to me? I certainly don?t understand it.
Such question have been around since at least the beginning of our recorded history. Problems concerning God most always have one thing in common: they are all based on the belief that God/our Source, is a thing. An anthropomorphized deity which is simply another part or piece within the universe. A finite "person" restricted to space and time. Such a flaccid, little, man-made god can never equate with the wonder and marvel of the wondrous universe. Never ever. As long as this limited idea of God is embraced as truth, questions and dilemmas such as this will multiply or be repeated forever. The answers are outside the fundamental religious paradigm. Outside the mental realm. j
-
A Paduan
Because of this bias, it was assumed that Paul's words were a condemnation of homosexuals, when in fact Paul was actually condemning cowardice.
I had thought that the effeminacy (not effeminancy as I spelled before) referred to was the condition of "being easily swayed" - i.e. lacking integrity / effeminate in mind - it approaches cowardice and is perhaps a component of that, but I think perhaps different - cowardice could be effeminacy in action coupled with fearfullness.
But as for condemning people of certain sexual tendancy............ just shows what sort of things fear and true effeminacy can lead to.
-
drwtsn32
lmao doc....your right...it makes no 'sens'...:P
LOL...oops. I must have had you on my mind.
-
SanFranciscoJim
I had thought that the effeminacy (not effeminancy as I spelled before) referred to was the condition of "being easily swayed" - i.e. lacking integrity / effeminate in mind - it approaches cowardice and is perhaps a component of that, but I think perhaps different - cowardice could be effeminacy in action coupled with fearfullness.
I agree with you, A Paduan. I think we are thinking along the same wavelength, but expressing ourselves in a different manner. Being easily swayed is a form of cowardice. In ancient times (and still quite often in our era), lack of backbone is considered an effeminate trait. Paul's reference was directly related to those who had already joined the early Christian congregation, but who were reconsidering their faith, being tempted to dabble with pagan ritual commonly practiced in their region. Paul's reference to "effeminate" ones speaks volumes about how he percieved women. This can be clearly seen in Paul's other writings -- he demanded submission in all forms to men. Some have speculated that Paul himself may have been gay. I personally do not agree with this analysis. I believe he was a misogynist, as was taught him by pharasaic law. In Paul's eyes, nothing could be more insulting to a man than to refer to him as "effeminate". It would be an allusion to cowardice, spinelessness, and a lack of integrity.