Over population

by mickbobcat 35 Replies latest social current

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  redvip2000

  Ahh yes, the elephant in the room. Nobody wants to talk about it. Go to any party and listen to anybody say how they have 4, 5 kids and people will congratulate them in happiness. Not me, I look at them and think how irresponsible they are.

  Sure 11 billion people would probably be fine if people lived off growing veggies in their backyard and raised chickens and rabbits. But this is 2021, and each one of us have a gigantic footprint on the planet, with our ipads, flights, gadgets, clothes, copious amounts of food, etc.

  I would guess to say that even 3 billion would be probably more than the ideal number, considering the amount of stuff we need.

  I suspect the planet at some point will remind us of what are continue to ignore.
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  pistolpete

  I would guess to say that even 3 billion 1 billion would be be about right.

  Imagine the earth with only ONE BILLION HUMANS.
  
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  mickbobcat

  There is no issue on the planet but over population. We can burn all the fossil fuel we want and build what we want if there were only 3 billion people. But 8 billion and growing is killing the planet. No one wants to talk about it because the only way to stop it going to be very strict crack downs on peoples right to reproduce. Even China had a hard time pushing it with all the power the state has over its people. The religious nuts go so far as to say once an egg is fertilized its a human. This is of course hog wash. As population grows it stresses out nature. We are seeing long line nets strip the oceans of life. That is just a fact. Blue Fin Tuna and some Shark species are in danger. People keep pushing into the wild areas taking more and more land for urban expansion and its giving wild life less and less to survive on. Farming is only kept going to supply the world with food due to petrochemical and corporate farming tactics. We have about 20 to 50 years of the way we are going before its a disaster. When we were at even 2 billion people the difference between rich and poor nations was drastic. The third world at the time lived very sustainable life's. Now people in the most poor countries want and have cell phones Internet, and other things that would have been thought impossible 50 years ago. China was a backward nation now its growing leaps and bounds and its people all want cars and homes and all the trappings of modern life same with India ect.

  Global warming I have my doubts about. If it is a thing or as bad as some say I think it has a lot to do with cycles of warming and cooling of the earth by nature and sun cycles. But that said over population is causing issues every where. Extinction, food is limited, even during covid we saw how fast food and supplies can be interrupted. To expand food production we see deforestation in places like South America and others. as we push into arable lands and build more and more homes and other things we are using up our land faster and faster. 90 percent of all water used by humans is used for food production. We have no unlimited water source. Some Aqua-firs are closed and when out they stay empty. Some are not closed but replenish very slow. Making water from sea water is possible but costs a lot of time and money and people are used to water that is cheap. Nestle is buying up water rights everywhere in the third world as they see this as a good investment.

  The man who predicted the 08 crash moved to buying high water produced vegetables and fruit stocks. There is a saying that one day will will have to give up our 3000 mile salads. It costs a lot of time water ect to move vegetables from Mexico or over seas or even California to other states in winter.
  

  In the early 18th century most people in temperate climates did not see fruits like bananas or oranges ect. Oil has allowed us to live like kings. Now even poor in first world countries have TV, AC, cars cell phones and all the food they could want. Its just not sustainable.
  
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  Anony Mous

  In the 50s they said that 3B people was unsustainable, in the 80s they said that 6B was unsustainable.
  The facts are that we now use approx. 10% less agricultural space compared to the 1950s and about 50% fewer farmers which collectively grow enough food for 1.5 times the current world population (that is how much food is wasted)
  
  What makes you think it is unsustainable to have 11B people? We are still developing even better farming and now going vertical to take even less space. We have sufficient fossil fuels to last 300 years at current burn rates, the earth in the worst case will warm by ~0.9C by 2120. Do note that cooling the earth by ~1-3C as people on the left often claim, actually happened in the “year with no summer”, due to a volcanic eruption, you can read about the crop failures and starvation that resulted, global warming is accelerating plant growth.
  The population will stop growing as people become rich (which is currently true for everyone in the developed world and most of the underdeveloped world, except about 10% of Asia and Africa), they tend to have a much lower child production rate.
  China just announced they eradicated poverty and India isn’t far behind, which would eradicate poverty in all but the Muslim countries in the world.
• 

  Simon

  The best solution was on the HitchHikers Guide to the Galaxy, where they built three spaceships. They put the useless people on the 3rd, and "let them go first" ...
• 

  redvip2000

  What makes you think it is unsustainable to have 11B people?

  Good grief, even as we burn our rainforests to make room for grain, as we expect meat production to have to increase by 100% soon, deplete our oceans of fish, continue to back wildlife into smaller reservations as we flatten forests to build housing, have entire islands of floating plastic in our oceans, along any other of 1000 ways we our hurting our home, some folks will never be convinced.

  We have lots of fossil fuels to burn, and we can produce lots of food, therefore all is well folks

  China just announced they eradicated poverty and India isn’t far behind

  What fine examples of how overpopulation is no biggie. A country full of slums where people shit in open air, and the biggest polluter in the world where masks were common even before COVID.
  
  
  
  
• 

  FedUpJW

  Imagine the earth with only ONE BILLION HUMANS.

  JW's imagine an earth with only a little over 8,000,000.
  
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  mickbobcat

  Mous, its how the agriculture has changed. They are maxing yield's by petro chemicals and gene modifications. But at the same time run off from these chemicals are causing destruction with things such as Red Tide blooms and poisoning the oceans. This chart in the link shows that we are using today half of all habitable land for agriculture. https://ourworldindata.org/global-land-for-agriculture. Another thing with gene modification is lack of diversity leaving crops open to destructive disease and other damage. Crop agriculture land use is not where things have went down but its feel lots. Where ranches used large tracts of land for cows, sheep ect they now use feed lots that cram animals into extremely restrictive paddocks or corrals and kept feeding constantly t make them grow with the help of antibiotics and hormones as fast as possible. Chickens today you buy at the store would not be recognized 50 years ago. They are bread to grow breast meat as fast as possible. The chickens are not even able to walk when grown. The oceans have been over fished so that the stocks are collapsing. Cod a cheap good meat 50 years ago is not expensive compared to what it once was and limits have been put on fishing to try to restore numbers. Most of the fish you eat today is a lie as to wild caught, just as much of the imported honey is not even real honey. The Chinese keep trying to beat testing and coming up with god knows what to make it taste like real honey. Tilapia is raised mostly in Asia and the farms are so disgusting they fish get tumors all over the body. Soon it will be you are eating soylent green.
  
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  mickbobcat

  LMAO China has not eliminated poverty nor has or will they or India. That is one of the most stupid things I have every heard. That and GPing saying that covid was a US military leak. LOL. You have to be really dumb to buy that crap. People who go to china say even the wealthy live very very modestly and the poor live on factory floors ect. So what they Chinese have done is eliminate the wealthy. China is one of if not the biggest polluters in the world and seen no need to stop. Hell they can not. If they do then its all hell breaking loose. They are afraid of 1. some billion people with pitchforks.
  
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  mickbobcat

  Redvip, burning rain forests for cattle ect is a fools game, the soil is poor and it only lasts a few short years before its desert. In Asia its deforestation to plant palm oil trees. This is used in everything from shampoo to ice-cream, lipstick, chocolate, pizza, bread, detergent ect. We are dancing on a razors edge and most people don't see it or don't want to see it. How many think its going to as normal after Covid and maybe it will but not for ever. Inflation, and IMO Hyper Inflation is coming down the pike. The USA has been irresponsible with money for many years. Hell we bankrupted the USSR in the cold war and almost did it to our self and are still spending like a drunken sailor. We are set up for one hell of a crash in this world and I don't think anyone can do anything about it. Some well meaning eco nut eating only green no package foods is like trying to bail out the ocean with an Eye dropper. It may make you feel good but does nothing. In many cases it actually makes things worse. I.E Tesla and Wind generators, People think they are helping by buying a Tesla or some EV but the carbon foot print it takes to make one is huge and it still takes coal or NG to make the electricity. You can not have total green energy in electricity, You have to have a coal or NG plant idling in the back ground to run up once the sun is not shining and or the wind not blowing. Not to mention Wind cost more to manufacture and up keep and only lasts about 20 years or so before it needs maintenance. The only thing that could hold off things is to cut population. No one is going to volunteer for the disintegration chamber.