Update on the $4000 day fine - Padron v Watchtower

by berrygerry 23 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

  • berrygerry
    berrygerry

    From reddit:

    This was an oral argument to dismiss the $4000/day fine. Both sides presented their arguments and now the judges will write an opinion (30 to 90 days). There were no recording devices, laptops/tablets or cellphones allowed so I got as much as I could by just trying to furiously take notes. It was very fast, both sides had about 20 minutes. I hope I got the gist with few errors. I felt lost a few times when they referred back to things that I hadn’t seen or been aware of prior. I found out later San Diego Reader was there so his article will be more succinct, but he probably will leave off the juicy details. ;)

    Francis McNamara for Watchtower was up first and right off the bat one of the judges was exasperated with Watchtowers inconsistency in their position. This is one time I wish I would have read the brief prior (still haven’t had a chance) because this line of communication started with a bang and I wasn’t aware that Watchtower had flip flopped. If anyone has any information on this I’d love to hear it. The judge actually said “it’s a breathtaking process to listen to you flip flop” their first position seems to have come around to bite them and now they’re in a uphill battle.

    Another judge asked if they have a bigger issue with the amount of the fine or the principal of the fine and told them to decide what their real issue is. Watchtower contended that the two cases are different (Lopez and Padron), that the sanction is not authorized by law and that they should have had a contempt procedure and gone back to trial court.

    Zalkin said a contempt statute only allows for a one time sanction, that a solid basis for the sanction has been provided and the court does have authority to enforce orders / monetary sanctions as part of discovery.

    Watchtower keeps contending that it doesn’t have control of CCJW (Christian Congregation of JWs) or custody of the documents because CCJW is a separate corporation. Apparently the service desk is under CCJW. Zalkin explained to the judge that that is just all smoke and mirrors. Watchtower admitted that document production would be “unduly burdensome” and now they are trying to claim they are a completely separate entity with no authority over CCJW. One judge said “why would it be burdensome to Watchtower if you have nothing to do with CCJW, seems like you are playing a game here” . They’ve made inconsistent declarations where it suits them per usual. Watchtower said the burden is that Watchtower and CCJW share a legal department. I could tell none of the judges are buying any of this.

    With regard to the redactions Watchtower is claiming that because the congregations are small having elders and victims names revealed would impact privacy issues and freedom of religion. Zalkin said that the trial court heard motion after motion about privacy and there was mention of limiting use but I wasn’t clear on that point, again I’m sure the brief has details. This was towards the end and when the judge said “seems like you just want to come back again and again until the end of time”. They all seemed extremely annoyed so that’s good news.

    I was overwhelmed knowing I had to get it all down with just notes so again, I hope I didn’t leave too much out or make errors but the opinion will be out soon and hopefully we are closer to a resolution.

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat

    Very interesting. How much do they owe now? Is it likely they will ever pay, I wonder. Or produce the documents. Or, presumably, both!

  • Diogenesister
    Diogenesister

    Many thanks for taking it for the team😊Very interesting....."flip flopping" eh? Can't help themselves.

    the judge said "Seems like you just want to come back again and again until the end of time."

    He has no idea how much they're hoping this happens!!

  • shepherdless
    shepherdless

    I think the amount owing now is nearing $2 million. They will have to produce the docs eventually, if they lose the appeal. They must be very damning documents.

  • Doubting Bro
    Doubting Bro

    Thanks for the update. I think if the WT loses, the flood of lawsuits could be problematic for them. That's why they are fighting tooth and nail. The 2m fine is nothing compared to what could happen.

  • cofty
    cofty

    Thanks very much for the update.

    If a dislike appears for the OP that was my clumsy fingers. Sorry!

  • carla
    carla

    Thank you for the update! I was just thinking about that case the other day.

  • pale.emperor
    pale.emperor

    Watchtower keeps contending that it doesn’t have control of CCJW (Christian Congregation of JWs) or custody of the documents because CCJW is a separate corporation.

    I had to re-read that sentence about 4 times, surely i was wrong... wasn't i? Watchtower has no control over the congregations? This will come as a great surprise to my JW family.

  • ttdtt
    ttdtt

    A lawyer told me once - winning is one thing - getting paid is another.

  • flipper
    flipper

    Thanks Berrygerry for the update. WT leaders will do ANYTHING to keep that list of pedophiles from getting out into the open public. I'm sure there's very damaging evidence of higher up WT leaders, elders, and other names of JW men on that list and that it will show a timeline that in spite of WT leaders names being on the list- that they continued to be appointed to or serve in positions of oversight and authority within the organization still. THAT is what WT legal is so worried about being exposed. That they KNOWINGLY appointed these men into positions of power even though they were pedophiles. At that point Pandora's Box gets opened up and WT's situation REALLY gets sticky legally and in the public media. I can't wait. I'm ordering my special popcorn to watch the show. This has been a long time in coming. Karma's coming back to bite them in the ass. WT leaders deserve all of this negative attention. Criminals running a criminal organization. Peace out, Mr. Flipper

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