I just read the entire 1st chapter of romans. and what I see, is despite the claim that Jesus died so that sins would be forgiven. this is a chapter warning people in verse,5, to come under law or else..
5. is Through him we received grace and apostleship to call all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from[c] faith for his name’s sake. 6 And you also are among those Gentiles who are called to belong to Jesus Christ.
this is the proof that the 'gentiles' are still viewed as sinful, and need to 'come [be obedient] to the true god and JOIN the faith of those under the law of Israel. paul was under that old law, and taught as such.
verse 18 paul starts a long winded reminder of how evil these people are....and that gods wrath is on them.
where is the forgiveness for being born in sin ?[ I dont see anywhere here from this letter that would harmonize with the idea that jesus died for sins ]
verse 20 to me, paul is saying that if they can see all the creation, and benefit from it, then they have no excuse for being led to be 'sinful' and need to come under law to be made 'perfect'. [naturally a mans reasoning here]
in fact verse 18 says
18 The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness
so all those things GOD does on purpose, to sinful humans? so funny to 'suppress truth' by the 'wickedness' to me means they deny that belief system and so they are the evil ones. same old argument.
then in chapter 2 it says this in vs 9
9 There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10 but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11 For God does not show favoritism.
Always first to the jew then the gentile, but god shows no favoritism? how so? if he just said in the last chapter that God gave them UP?
Ill honestly say, I have never heard anyone in my lifetime, express the idea that nature was ever imperfect. its only humans that are imperfect.
my mom still holds to the thought that Satan has creative powers,
because there is no need for any creatures on earth to be sucking blood,
and spreading disease, since blood is sacred to god, [so they are
Satan's creations] and any creation that is ugly and dangerous and will
kill a human with one bite is a creation of satan.
here is how an explanation would go from my family and those others I was exposed to...
Lets say there was a conversation about how animals kill for food, well, thats because this was gods way of keeping the population in check,and for food, its a perfect creation. no imperfection in the animal world as far as these ones are concerned. God has a sense of humor to create so many interesting and funny animals all for our enjoyment.
Now i do agree with the logic, the reason for bacteria killing off people? plague, for example, yes imperfection on the human end of things, my mom would say...
'well those people were not careful and clean, and they had weak immune systems, imperfection due to their being born in a sinful state, soon that will all be fixed..' bla bla bla.
natural disasters these days of course , are blamed on imperfect men and their mismanagement of the earth.. ..he will bring to ruin, those who ruin the earth
and homosexuality to my mom, and most of the ones I have known, say it is sin and imperfection, and not a result of genetics. its evil selfish satanic influence, lol. she would never entertain the idea that a child could ever have homosexual leanings, they all think that only an adult makes the choice to become gay because they have warped sexual desires. [oddly, they have no logical explanation as to why that would be the case that a person would choose to have sex with a man rather than a woman, if the end result is the same..... orgasm, lol.]
