The Bread Illustration (Feb 16 Broadcast) - Massive Contradiction

by fizzle 31 Replies latest jw friends

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  fizzle

  So... Bro Flodin puts poison onto the first loaf of bread and says that this pictures someone "sinning against the holy spirit". He then puts the bread into the trash can stating that Jehovah completely discards anyone "sinning against the holy spirit"... Meaning they cannot ever be forgiven...
  
  He says that The Pharisees "sinned against the holy spirit" because they denied indisputable evidence of the operation of Jehovah's Holy Spirit displayed by Jesus... Therefore Jehovah would completely discard them... No way back for them.

  Fast forward a little... We have the bible character Stephen...
  
  Acts 6:8 says: Now Stephen, full of divine favor and power, was performing great wonders and signs among the people.
  
  So Stephen was showing indisputable evidence of the operation of Jehovah's Holy Spirit.
  
  Now we come to the bible character Paul (Saul)... He was a Pharisee.
  
  Paul would have seen Stephen in action... Witnessing the indisputable evidence of the operation of Jehovah's Holy Spirit first hand!
  
  Yet Paul not only waged war against all Christians but he personally approved the killing (stoning) of Stephen.
  
  According to the Bread illustration Paul should have been discarded by Jehovah at this point for "sinning against the holy spirit"... He would have been put in the trash can... No way back at all...
  
  But what happened according to the bible? Jesus appeared to him on the road to Damascus... He became one of the most zealous apostles in bible history with Jehovah's full support!
  
  So what on earth is the Bread illustration all about? What a load of nonsense!
  
  Your thoughts?
  
  fizzle
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  slimboyfat

  You seem to be asking the scriptures to be internally consistent, or else for JW commentary to be consistent with the scriptures. Contemplating how to go about establishing either makes my head hurt from the get go.

  But I did notice he never gave any real sort of working definition of what it means to "sin against the Holy Spirit". It was sort of left to the imagination. Unless I missed something?
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  sparrowdown

  I'd say the bread illustration is a warning to all apostates.

  Poisoned garlic bread (apostates) go straight into Jehovah's trashcan never to retrieved.
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  juandefiero

  Here's how they would probably explain it:

  "The ones that are discarded are the ones that die before they turn around from their course. The Apostle Paul turned around from his wicked course, and thus was forgiven."
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  brandnew

  @slim......yeah.....what are the unforgiveable sins? He never made out a list😡😡😡

  Mad Puppy
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  nowwhat?

  Great point about the apostle paul
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  zophar

  I agree with nowwhat? Great point about Paul.

  I think it was the old Aid book that said the "unforgivable sin" was, "denying an obvious manifestation of the holy spirit." The example used of the religious leaders bribing the soldiers assigned to guard Jesus tomb for them not to speak of Jesus resurrection even though those leaders knew what the soldiers had seen. Their interest was in preserving their position and denying Jesus. What else could be done to convince them? Therefore they were guilty of unforgivable sin.
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  slimboyfat

  To say that the broadcast contradicted itself is I think in some sense to give it too much credit. What was wrong with it was not that some parts don't fit with other parts. The problem is that it's pure nonsense all the way through, from beginning to end, every single aspect of it in a multitude of ways.
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  ttdtt

  Talk about contradiction?

  At about the 37th minute of this month's Broadcast Brother Loaf of Bread says that Grieving the Holy Spirit includes"using deceitful words"

  Isn't that what Brother Jackson did over and over during the RC testimony he gave? Did he not lie and obfuscate when he said things like "It's Not My Field"as just one example.
  
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  James Mixon

  So who today blaspheme the Holy spirit.

  We have the Jews who do not accept Jesus as the Messiah.

  Hindus say the teenage Jesus traveled across southeast Asia, learning yogic traditions

  and returning home to be a guru to the Jews.

  Muslims: Jesus was not crucified but instead, he was raised up by God into the heavens.

  In other words it seems every one besides JW's are speaking "against the Holy spirit".

  How many Holy spirits are out there, and which one do you listen too?