by nicolaou 34 Replies latest members private
To me the most obvious misinformation is the number they used. It is PEAK publishers - and not AVERAGE publishers which would be a MORE HONEST representation. Or better yet use the LOWEST month total.
AND REALLY! I have never been asked "How do we count our membership" - how does that get into the FAQ's?
I'm sure more people ask - "So why do you let Pedifiles operate in your congregations without letting the authorities or other parents know?"
Sir 82 and konceptual you two are both spot on with how it really it is!
Blondie and heaven- I too from childhood could never understand why time reporting was always require. I asked my dad and some local elders about this and I remember always getting the standard reply. "Oh its so the brothers around the world can be encouraged by the numbers in the yearbook of our preaching activity worldwide!"
Such a bunch of bologne. Likesir82 mentioned it only serves a purpose for imperfect men to judge you and try to decipher your spiritual status based up on numbers.
''Blondie and heaven- I too from childhood could never understand why time reporting was always require.''
I too wondered about this for ages. But over time you just realize that it's just another gauge, or control mechanism to judge and hold merit for people of ''value'' in a high control group.
Sir82, that was perfectly spot on!
You summed it up so well!
aaah--so this explains a lot
"We count as Jehovah’s Witnesses only those who are actively preaching the good news of God’s Kingdom each month."
now i understand why my late father died in his care home--no visits from any jw's in over 2 years.........they no longer regarded him as a jw.----so no need to visit him
After reading the 1954 Walsh case, the transcript of Rutherford's trial in 1918, as well as parts of the book Jehovah's Witnesses in the Divine Purpose, I became convinced that the primary reason for all these rules about 'who is a publisher', the invention of the classification of 'pioneer', and even the reporting of hours and keeping records of those hours, all has to do with the presentation of evidence to the draft boards. The reporting of hours started soon after the 1919 release from prison. In that trial they were faulted for not having a definitive way to show who was a member and who was not. No hours recorded, no membership rolls, nothing. All they could point to was the subscription list to the Watchtower magazine which anyone could get for $1 a year. So while the keeping of hours has morphed into an ugly control mechanism, I believe it was started for legal reasons related to the draft issue.
dropoff: I believe it was started for legal reasons related to the draft issue
Yes, that makes total sense
That is where the "each and every one of us is an ordained minister" came from, in spite of that not holding up in court a lot of the time
Preaching activity = ordained minister = "volunteer" for charitable tax purposes
All they could point to was the subscription list to the Watchtower magazine which anyone could get for $1 a year
Didn't the WTS issue a "colporteur" card to each of their salesmen? A certificate required by law such that they could engage in selling books
Yet, that card would just allow them to operate, it didn't define them as "ordained ministers", which became paramount once they challenged the courts on the draft issue, which then morphed into the flag salute issue, etc
I don't know when the colporteurs started or if they had an identifying card, though it seems likely they did. Even so, I don't believe that was brought up in the 1918 Rutherford testimony. One of the damning things that they did in 1918 was that they gave out a signed Affidavit (signed by ones like Rutherford and Van Amburgh) to young men who then presented the Affidavit to their draft board. The Affidavit stated that they were a pacifist religious group and claimed they were exempt from the draft on those grounds. They were unable in court to substantiate that the Affidavits were given out to legitimate people. All of this ran against the Espionage Act.
I recall that in the Walsh case testimony (in Scotland in 1954) Franz and Covington were adamant that the pioneer, which Walsh was, was 'nothing like the colporteur'. The colporteur was more of a salesman and they had been unable to get the draft boards to accept that a book salesman qualified as a minister. With Walsh, they were finally able to get a JW recognized as a minister of a known religion. The touched on a number of things that made him 'Qualified to be a Minister'. Recorded hours in field service was one. Another was the Ministry School, which was for men only in the beginning (again, for draft support reasons).
Didnt the organized book a make some mention of our time cards may be how Jehovah is keeping track of how the preqching work is being accomplished?
dropoff: I don't know when the colporteurs started or if they had an identifying card, though it seems likely they did.
I think they did - not sure the year they started to issue them but it had a lot to do with using railroad transportation
It was issued, I believe, so the IBSA colporteurs could qualify for reduced fares on the railroad. Ministers rode for free(?) or reduced rates
*I have an image of the certificate but I think it is on another hard drive - I will look for it
