Jesus fulfilling old testament prophecies like his legs not being broken

by Isambard Crater 60 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • myelaine

    You have a distinct lack of reading comprehension.

    You have a nice evening too.

  • OnTheWayOut
    You have a distinct lack of reading comprehension.

    I have already given you your victory in that nothing can penetrate your views, your mind like a steel trap has closed. But that isn't enough for you. So lets clear this up so you can fully enjoy believing that you proved your point.

    The bible is inarguably considered to be the holy text of christians and jews. It's not the holy text of any other religions.

    You seem to think you are pinging me on not understanding your claims. Well, if so then you misspoke here.

    Of course I didn't think you were saying that ALL PEOPLE (or even a majority of ALL PEOPLE) consider the Bible to be the holy text of Christians and Jews. I mean- so many people consider the Bible to be the writings of men. So I figured you must have been trying to say that Christians and Jews consider the Bible to be holy texts.

    It depends on which writings and which groups of Christians and Jews we are talking about. But the Bible is definitely not unarguably considered to be the holy text of Christians and Jews, The Bible is considered to be "BELIEVED TO BE HOLY" by Christians and Jews. But so many people do not consider it the holy text of Christians and Jews. That means it is not inarguable.

    So forgive my reading comprehension problem. It was in the way your wrote, not the person reading it.

    I doubt you will see where you misspoke, but will just add this to your great victory.
  • OnTheWayOut
    Isambard Crater,
    it wasn't as off-topic as it seems, this silly argument.

    It shows that people write things and then insist that others see it the way they wrote it.

    It could be the NT writings or it could be myelaine's thoughts. I hope you can see how someone writes something and then is so sure that settles the matter. The NT writers could do the same thing.
  • JaniceA

    Anyone wonder why God couldn't have written a holy book that would need theologians, interpretation, philosophy and linguistics experts to discern the message? It doesn't matter how many of us sincerely sought truth, we needed to be able to evaluate every point of the book and the men who wrote it, lived it and teach it. And bully for us if we discern it incorrectly or follow the wrong teacher or philosophy.

    That is the God that's going to judge me? The God who created me to have trouble with long division expects me to figure out the mysteries of the universe in between making a living, raising a family and keeping up with my profession, technology and current events?

    So, yeah, you can call me an idiot. But I spent years sincerely trying to seek after the truth and realized that basic human decency cuts across religion, philosophy and politics. So does evil.

    So Jesus or God will send me to hell or destroy me for believing wrong when all I have REALLY is a book written in a coded language filled with meanings informed by prehistoric cultures and dead languages that can't be directly translated.

  • myelaine

    dear OnTheWayOut...

    Since you took the time to reply:

    I didn't make any claims that the author(s) of the bible weren't men.

    I didn't make any claims that others besides christians and jews held any reverence for the bible, only that it was considered the holy text of the christians and jews.

    Because you assure me you don't have a reading comprehension problem then is there some other reason why you don't answer straight forward questions, some other reason why you dodge them? For your convenience and just in case you are struggling with the aforementioned disability as well, I've made this diagram to help you answer my last question.

  • OnTheWayOut
    I didn't make any claims that .......only that......

    No, you said that things were inarguable. So you played the ultimate trump card. I was not able to argue with whatever you said, even when it was cloudy the way you said it. That's the end of the matter. You won.

    I don't even remember what further questions you say I didn't answer, what with being defeated because your stuff was inarguable. But I know I wasn't dishonest in anything I said, so you sure are a sore winner.
  • myelaine

    But you did argue my point about the holy texts. You twisted what I said in your argument but you certainly took the opportunity to argue my point.

  • myelaine

    dear JaniceA...

    I'm sending you a pm if you'd like to hear a christian's response to your post. If you don't, that's okay too :)

  • OnTheWayOut

    Okay okay okay.

    I will get back on track with the opening post and the problem there, and at the same time try to satisfy myelaine's questions.

    I had to go back and look for the questions. Here they are

    Do you deny that jerusalem society was greatly and irreversibly impacted by a noteable person of jewish descent in the 1st century? (A luminary, so to speak)

    Do you deny that it is that same person who was essentially responsible for gentile interest or belief in the God of the OT?

    I do indeed deny that Jerusalem society was greatly impacted by a noteable person of Jewish descent if you imply that person was Jesus Christ.
    There is absolutely no evidence that such a person existed at that time and he was written about long after that time. The Jesus that Paul first wrote about was a mystical figure with no clear human history.

    Movements to follow several mystical gods started and Jesus won out. I am sure at least one particular person will say that is for the reason that Jesus was real. I don't go along with that. And even if he was a real person, that doesn't mean he was a god, God's son, or in any way more than a man like many of the others trying to start a following. Stories about him written long after his life could easily be completely fictional even if they are based on an actual human.

    The great impact upon the Jews at that time was the end of their way of life because of the conflict with Rome.

    I think knowing where I stand firmly on this will tell why I won't bother with more arguments with those that are so set that "of course it was all real."

  • myelaine


    dear Isambard Crater...

    There are prophecies that you can read that have the needed "element" of measureability. Some prophecies have to be taken on faith as being fulfilled. The no bones broken as representitive of a perfect sacrificial lamb is not measurable. That and other prophecies would have been a great witnessing tool for people who were there and saw how the ministry and crucifixion of Jesus unfolded. I believe that is precisely why so many did accept Jesus as the expected Messiah, jews especially.

    Please keep in mind that intellectual acceptance isn't the same as emotional acceptance. The latter being the type of acceptance that involves a level of commitment that you may not be inclined to pursue. You would be the best judge of that :)

    love michelle

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