Visit From Jehovah's Witnesses

by Vanderhoven7 76 Replies latest jw experiences

  • Vanderhoven7

    Had two lovely JWs (Stephen and Ruth) visit this morning. This was our second study in the last 2 weeks. They first knocked on my door (bell is out) 3 weeks ago and I shared my testimony and we arranged to meet last Tuesday which we did.

    Our first study went like this:

    I explained to S&R that I could only accept from their religion what is biblically supported. I then listed 4 requirements that would validate any doctrine or position as biblical.

    1. there had to be one scripture at least

    2. that scripture or scriptures must not be altered, added to, subtracted from etc.

    3. verses cannot be linked unless there is proof that they are related. (e.g. parallel passages)

    4. context; textual, situational, historical must be considered.

    They agreed these were good rules that could reduce doctrinal error.

    Then I gave them a verse of scripture (Matthew 13:44) the parable of a man walking in a field, finding and hiding a treasure and selling all to buy the field. I then asked them if it was biblical or beyond what is biblical to teach that the man was Joseph Smith who found gold plates in a field in upper state NY in 1827.

    They agreed that this was extra-biblical and that impregnating the scriptures with their own church history represented interpretive abuse.

    Then I asked them if it was possible that their entire religion was founded on the exact same interpretive abuse.

    For example - Does the Bible does teach:

    1. that the 1914 generation is the terminal generation.

    2. that the first resurrection began in the spring of 1918

    3. that Jesus Christ rejected all of the churches of Christendom in the fall of 1918

    4. that a special group of men at headquarters in Brooklyn NY were appointed by Jesus in 1919 providing them with exclusive mandate and unique ability to interpret the Bible for all believers.

    5. that the sounding of the seven trumpets of Revelation got under way in 1922 at a Bible student convention at Cedar Point Ohio..

    6. that since1935 God has been calling a group of Christians who are not born again sons of God who are not part of the new covenant arrangement and do not have a heavenly hope.
    7. that 1975 marked the year that man had been on the earth for 6000 years

    They fumbled all over the place; tried to change the subject, talked about how wonderful the organization is without admitting anything.

    During the discussion they denied the organization enforced unity of doctrine, they could be disfellowshipped and shunned for holding views contrary to official doctrine emanating from Brooklyn. They denied there would be repercussions

    I later gave them a list of their unique doctrines that I would be willing to study: including Matthew 24, Revelation 7, Acts 15, Acts 20:20

    They agreed to return this week...which they did (to my pleasant surprise. No time to relate todays meeting; picking up my wife in 10 minutes

  • nicolaou

    Would you be willing to shine a similar logic on your own beliefs Vanderhoven?

    For instance, would you rewrite natural history to 'impregnate' it with your own beliefs?

    Is it "possible that [your] entire religion was founded on the exact same interpretive abuse?"

    Noah's flood?

  • Londo111

    JWs often practice theocratic warfare without even knowing it. It's amazing how they can deceive without intending to in order to present the organization in a good light.

  • nicolaou

    JWs are masters at the game Londo but in fairness all attempts to convince others of a particular religious belief involve a degree of duplicitous behaviour.

  • Londo111

    I’m very relativistic in outlook…to me there are unhealthy paths and healthier ones, but no one size fits all. Unless it’s into another totalitarian cult, any spiritual path to a healthier outlook than what the Watchtower mandates is a good one.

  • scratchme1010

    My take, we're talking about a book that was written thousands of years ago, in extremely limited languages, at a time when humanity was the most naive in their world views, and written in parables, visions, and dreams.

    At this point in time and space in the history of humanity, I think that using that book to debate anything relevant to humanity today is just ridiculous.

    The bible is one of the most ancient, obsolete, antiquated and useless book in the entire planet right now. I'd rather get guidance from Microsoft Office 4.0 for DOS than the bible.

  • Tenacious

    @ scratchme1010 - Did you read the thread title before entering? Make your exit and don't bother coming back when the topic does not suit you and allow those that wish to discuss this topic to do so.

    @nicolaou - Vanderhoven is not discussing Noah's flood so please see your way out of this topic since it does not concern you.

    Both of you probably hate JW's and their despicable tactics such as misdirection and subterfuge and yet here you are both doing the same. Keep up the stupid work.

  • jaydee

    . marking

    Image result for reading emoji

  • DesirousOfChange

    Mr. V, thank you for sharing your experience with the JWs. I too am surprised that they returned. Evidently they must be pioneers who are desperate for anything that doesn't require 'cold calling' (D2D) in new territory. Your comparison to Joe Smith was brilliant. , , , , DOC

  • Heartsafire

    Ooo...can't wait for the update on this!

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