Using Illegal Means for Righteous Activism

by John Davis 99 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Listener
    Listener

    My questions varied from a minor crime to what could possibly be a more serious crime in certain countries. You've admitted that you would be willing to commit a crime and you've justified your reason for doing so. The point is, it's not all black and white and it isn't mentally healthy to consider that under every single circumstance you would be willing to abide be the law.

    You say that recording Elders without their permission is more serious than not wearing a seat belt or illegally parking but didn't say whether it was less serious than refusing to go to war. That's your personal opinion, personally I think not wearing a seat belt can be far more serious. A parent could be charged with a very serious crime if they hadn't properly restrained their child and had a nasty accident. Or parking illegally could result in something terrible, e.g. parking next to a hydrant could result in the loss of lives if the fire brigade couldn't access it to put out a fire.

    We all have our own measuring stick to determine when and whether we would break a law, either minor or major. Not too long ago, homosexual acts were against the law and still are in many countries yet there are many who are so inclined who are prepared to break those laws, the result is that slowly laws have changed and there is more acceptance within society. It's one example of how laws do change, because people are not always willing to abide by the laws as they currently stand.

    It is a very minor thing to record an elder in a Judicial Committee without his permission. On the other hand, through that Judicial Committee the Elder has the power to judge you as non repentant and cause friends and family to shun you. There are many who find those recordings very beneficial, that's why people are prepared to break the law and do it. The good outweighs the bad.

    It is are you willing to obey the law no matter what your motive may be either good or bad.

    That would be black and white and even you admitted that you would break the law.

    In the latter part of your comments you seem to be attempting to correlate recording Elders as 'seeking vengeance'. That's a bit over the top, especially when most of the recorded JC's that I've seen don't appear to be doing it for that reason at all. It's more to do with exposing them and warning others.

    I agree with you, let the law take care of it. In the case of recordings, perfect, now let's see the Elders start reporting those crimes and let the legal system take care of it. The likelihood of that happening is very slim, but if it's such a bad thing to do then why don't the Elders report it. If someone broke into their KH and caused damage they'd report it and without doubt, recording JC's causes much more damage.

    Personally, I feel the whole motive behind your post is to scare individuals off from recording their JC.



  • sparrowdown
    sparrowdown

    Listener said "...the whole motive behind your post is to scare individuals off from recording their JC."

    Personally I feel that JD/RO is a WT shill.

  • John Davis
    John Davis

    I did not mean to accuse anyone of breaking any laws or putting fear into anyone. I did not intend to put in my opinion, I was just wondering what other people's opinions are. I only gave my opinion when I was asked to give it. Obviously different states and different countries have different laws. But the question still stands do you think it is right to break the law if you think it is for a good cause.

  • OUTLAW
    OUTLAW

    I did not mean to accuse anyone of breaking any laws or putting fear into anyone.....JD/Richard Oliver

    guess who will be spending the rest of their life in a 5X10? That will be you. ....JD/Richard Oliver

    Image result for you`re not a complete idiot there are a few pieces missing

  • jp1692
    jp1692
    Listener: I feel the whole motive behind your post is to scare individuals off from recording their JC

    Well if that's the case, then any lurkers that are having reservations should read this old thread:


  • jp1692
    jp1692
    JD: the question still stands do you think it is right to break the law if you think it is for a good cause.

    Well, you asked the question and you've gotten answers from quite a few members of this forum: eight pages worth. That's pretty good results.

    The overwhelming response from members of this forum is: YES, most of us would, have and do break laws that we think are wrong, but we are willing to accept the consequences.

    So why do you now keep pressing it? It's just getting annoying.

  • John Davis
    John Davis

    Like JP said probably no one has ever been charged or even sued over recording a JC. My intention wasn't to frighten people. If you're going to record a JC or a conversation with Elders or the Branch my post probably ain't going to change that.

    I also did not intend to focus solely on the recording of conversations and I am sorry if I made it sound like that, but there are a ton of other things that people have done that is considered illegal for what they view as the right reasons.

    So I guess the real question is do you think that the ends always justify the means?

  • jp1692
    jp1692
    JD: I also did not intend to focus solely on the recording of conversations

    Perhaps, but it was the very first issue you brought up in your OP.

    JD: do you think that the ends always justify the means? [Bold addd]

    Not always, but certainly sometimes. Again, the use of the world "always" shows that problematic black-and-white, all-or-nothing thinking that I and others on this thread have repeatedly cautioned against.

  • sparrowdown
    sparrowdown

    JD - You keep saying you want opinions and you are getting opinions, but why do want them and what are you doing with them??? TBH It seems more than just idle curiosity driving you.

  • John Davis
    John Davis

    I was reading this thread and it made me think about this subject.

    https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/228408/anonymous-message-watchtower?page=16

    Like I said earlier a number of people on that thread were promoting the breaking of the law to get something accomplished.

    Since then there has been a number of developments that were completed through legal means and wanted to see how people still think on the subject.

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