The GB know it's all lies and wants to dismantle the WTS ... then what?

by Simon 31 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • crazy_flickering_light

    A change could be very easy. Open the door from the jail and let the slaves go.

    If they drop the disfellowshiping and shunning, it will went down very fast. Then it's easier to make a change, because everybody can say and do how he like. If there is no risk to wake up people, the revolution comes from inside. There enough people waiting for the right moment. At this time it's a hard job, to wake up some friends.

    But first the shunning had to stop. It's the only thing which keep the people in the cult. I think this will only ends, if there a lot of pressure from the outside.

  • ttdtt

    That's complete fantasy unfortunately.

    If they wanted to shut it down they would only need to do 2 things.

    1: End DFing

    2: Make Field Service optional.

    It would be over pretty quick.

  • LoveUniHateExams

    Good OP, Simon.

    do you gradually introduce policies to turn the screws to make it less attractive or loosen them to make people less devoted and zealous? - if I were at the top I'd definitely loosen the screws over a period of time. I'd try to make sure that when I go, other liberal reformers took my place.

    Perhaps the move from D2D witnessing to manning literature carts might mean that JWs avoid calling on unpleasant/violent people. Within a year or two, I'd go one further and stop the preaching work altogether. This would protect JWs and give them more personal time. The reasoning I'd use to please hardliner GB members would be that we have done an extensive witnessing campaign and we have a website that we advertise.

  • done4good

    The WT is much like a person trying to keep the snout of a wild dog closed. The R&F is the wild dog. If they try to truly remove the authoritarian structure, that dog is going to bite them in the ass hard...They won't do it.

    The WT would lose at least 50% of its membership if it eliminated JCs, DF, shunning, and various other control mechanisms. The other 50% would slowly lose interest over time. This would be catastrophic for the organization financially. They won't do it. They are preferring to take the path of slowly dying out, albeit unwittingly.

    So what will they do? Observing from some distance, I would say they already have reached a tipping point, (if not just short of it). They are in the process of trying to determine a long-term strategy, (something they never had to do; authoritarian regimes rarely do). This is not familiar territory for them, and I believe they will fail at it, ultimately. At a bare minimum, they would need to soberly admit to not having the "truth", to begin with, since true reform only works when reality is faced. The catch is, they really cannot face that reality, as they are true believers, (even of their own bullshit). Belief is all about survival. Belief in their cause is critical to their survival. Without this, they fail. This is an inherent dilemma that has no clear-cut way forward, and will lead to their demise.

    It appears the pressures of social evolution are forcing them to make changes without a clear-cut strategy. Too many things about modern society stand in stark contrast to the charlatan nature of a 19th century end-times religious sect. All of their survival efforts to date have been tactical in nature, and are designed to preserve that 19th century dogma. Tactics only work for so long. At some point, a goal oriented strategy needs to be developed, and worked toward. However, any attempt to do this in a meaningful way will have its own adverse consequences, since it means admitting fault, (hence disbelief). Disbelief is anathema to the existence of religion.

    Lacking a strategy, they will continue to attempt to exist in a maze of society they are ill-equipped to exist within, and die a slow death, that will accelerate over time. It already is.


  • Xanthippe
    or loosen them to make people less devoted and zealous?

    Well I would get rid of the midweek book study; call the TMS our life and ministry reducing emphasis on preaching; reduce conventions to one day; make FS into just standing around handing out leaflets instead of stressful d2d work and turn it into a TV evangelist religion to keep regular money coming in.

    Then it's well on the way to becoming just a religion with church on Sunday and my position as a GB celebrity would be securely financed in my brand new out of town home in beautiful landscaping for the rest of my days. Oh .......

  • new boy
    new boy

    Not one person, or a group of people, or even a hundred people at the top can stop it.

    Follow the money. They only thing that could even slow it down is the complete lack of it.

    With billion coming their way with the sell off of Brooklyn that not going to happen anytime soon.

    Look at the catholic faith. If the leaders all denounced the faith they might lose a million or two but it would just keep going.

    People just don't want to believe that something they have invested 30, 40 or even 50 years of their lives in could possibly be wrong.

    There only thing that could stop it and all religions!

    If little green aliens came down and told us the true history of this planet and that all religions are bull shit. Then religion would start it's SLOW (taking hundreds of years) descent in to nonexistence.

  • Vidiot

    @ Simon...

    I think this is the first time you've ever acknowledged even the slight possibility that the WTS could - somehow - come to an end.

  • Finkelstein

    There is too much money and power still there in the WTS. so therefore the lies will continue and so will the WTS.

    There might be a slight slowing down of members as time progresses but the WTS isn't going to vanish anytime soon, at least not in are life time.

  • Simon
    I think this is the first time you've ever acknowledged even the slight possibility that the WTS could - somehow - come to an end.

    You're mischaracterizing my views.

    I absolutely believe they can end. I also believe Apple can end too ... the real question is how likely is it and how could it happen? I just prefer to be realistic.

    I don't think any number of YouTube exposé's is going to do it. I don't think it matters to followers whether their beliefs make sense or are true. The sheer number of Catholics, Muslims, Mormons, JWs etc ... who believe all shades of batshit crazy are 'testament' to that (yeah, pun intended).

    This topic is meant to point out the challenge of ending a large group like the JWs even if the leaders themselves wanted to end it they probably couldn't. And yet some believe that we can do it for them.

    Trying to destroy the WTS is fighting the wrong battle - one that can likely never be won. It's the equivalent of the war on drugs.

    I think it's better to focus on making information available and support for those who do awaken themselves and decide to leave. The ironic thing is that this is likely to do the most damage to the WTS than actual attempts to damage it.

    Ultimately though option #4 is the most threatening to the WTS long-term - judgements against it by courts and government agencies for their crimes and enforced change of practices that dilute their control and threaten their market share.

    But there's the thing - if you reduce one religion, you just increase another. When the WorldWide Church of God lost many of it's members, some stopped believing but many just went to other groups.

    It's going to take hundreds more years for the evolutionary hangover called religion to work it's way through humanities bowels.

  • Xanthippe

    I think it's quite easy to imagine my possible scenario without the GB feeling they are being dishonest turning it into just a religion and still allowing the R+F to finance their lifestyle. After all the party line they are feeding them now is well whenever the paradise comes it is still the best, most moral, most happifying way of life.

    Even if they think they've got the prophecies and the timing all wrong and they're not the spokesman of God they could still believe they deserve a comfortable lifestyle for giving people the best religion on earth. As for the rest, they might think, whenever Armageddon will come, we'll leave that to Jeho....whatever his name should be.

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