Providing salvation is not that important (page 2)

Finkelstein

By living a life of integrity and loyalty, Jesus had to prepare the way for Jehovah to accept his sacrifice.

I think this just another way for the WTS's leaders to propagate the assertion that its they (GB members) that have the only true correct righteous way to prepare oneself to make an appeasement to Jehovah through them.

Loyalty, loyalty loyalty

The GB are on their game of brainwashing people to their unending control and subservience.

Being that there is so much information out there that these men have been corrupt lying apostates (False Prophets) in their endeavor of proliferating their literature, expect to see more of this.

JoenB75

Biblically it is not possible to separate the glory of God from his salvation. The universal confession of Jesus as Lord is to the glory of God the Father (Philippians 2:11). God created people for his glory and for his pleasure (Isaiah 43:6-7, Revelation 4:11). Our sins have been forgiven for “his name’s sake” (1 John 2:12).

Of course we agree that the JW doctrine on Jesus is grotesque. I saw Stephen Lett say "Jesus loves you, but more importantly Jehovah loves you".

JoenB75

For the atheist, the biggest problem is the existence of evil. For the conservative Christian, "theologically rightminded protestant or catholic", the greatest problem of evil is the innocent sacrifice of Jesus, not starving babies born with inherint sin. To me, the sacrifice of God the Father as man, the Son of God, means that God participates in our creative suffering in a most mysterious and precious way. Don't make it too rational, it is not.

Finkelstein

For the atheist, the biggest problem is the existence of evil

Hardly we just accept that evil stems from other sources or intents.

It might be appealing and comforting to know someone died for their sins to be redeemed but it historically it never happened, to suggest or embrace such a thing might very well be an evil to humanity in itself.

cofty

For the atheist, the biggest problem is the existence of evil - Joen

Go on then I'll bite...

cofty

To me, the sacrifice of God the Father as man, the Son of God, means that God participates in our creative suffering in a most mysterious and precious way

I really want to explain why that is wrong

For the conservative Christian, "theologically rightminded protestant or catholic", the greatest problem of evil is the innocent sacrifice of Jesus, not starving babies born with inherint sin.

and also why that is wrong.

But let's start with the first point,

JoenB75

Cofty,

I understand this to be a free speech zone. You are wellcome to "bite" as much as you want

Sea Breeze

Free Will necessitates the existence of evil.

”problem” solved.

cofty

Joen - I hoped you would understand I meant something like, what do you mean when you wrote 'For the atheist, the biggest problem is the existence of evil'?

Did you mean that evil is the strongest reason for disbelief or that 'evil' is a difficult thing for atheists to account for?

Pete Zahut

According to any Christian Jesus died for their sins. According to any JW Jesus died for Adam's sin.

Who knows if anything in the Bible is true or actually happened? However for arguments sake, JW's believe Jesus death or ransom sacrifice was intended to buy back the life Adam and Eve lost for us, (their descendants) who inherited their sin.

It's a case of which came first....the chicken or the egg?

Adam and Eve's disobedience was the reason that the sacrifice had to take place and they are the reason we inherited sin and why we need Jesus sacrifice. He could have said "no way" but instead because of his "undeserved kindness" he allowed for this provision.

JW's believe Jesus died for both Adam's sin and their own inherited sin. But...they believe Jehovah is the one who allowed the life that Adam and Eve lost, to be bought back via Jesus sacrifice.

They fully honor Jesus and the sacrifice he made BUT they realize that had it not been for Jehovah, none of it could have happened.

Whether or not humans think it was unfair of God to punish everyone for what Adam and Eve did, is unimportant to JW"S. As the Creator of the universe, they feel he has every right to handle things any way he wants.

I might think it was dumb that a god who can do anything, created us so that we need food and air to survive. Why didn't he just create our bodies so we wouldn't need those things or so we didn't feel pain? A JW believes that we have no right to question the way god does things and whether or not we think his ways are fair is unimportant.

They believe that Jesus is important but without Jehovah...there would be no Jesus...no nothing....so they view him as #1 but that doesn't diminish Jesus sacrifice in their eyes.

Providing salvation is not that important

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