by teenyuck 37 Replies latest members adult
"No matter who the President is and whether or not you agree with them, you should show respect to someone in that office."
So using this logic, it was the right thing to do for the German people to respect Hitler in WW2? After all, he was their leader.
Perhaps all that Nurenburg trial business after the war was pointless? The Nazi's should have followed orders, out of respect for their leader.
Stan
Abaddon,
You said,
I'm amazed you are ignorant of your country's own immigration rules. You can't just move to the US, even if you want to.actually, you're wrong. All you have to do is go to Mexico and become a Mexican citizen first, we seem to let them in the country by Droves.
you've made the worst post you've ever made!
No, really, that one would be where I asked people about their oral hygiene. Was not a winner. Ask Tres Happy.
On to the subject. Sitting thougsands of miles away telling us what is wrong with our government and our country--you are free to do. Obviously.
So, if someone in a neigbouring village is doing things that seem stupid and potentially harmfull for the entire country, rather than discussing it with people who live in that village and might not realise what is happening, or might be misinformed by a town-crier who is biased, or might be to lazy to do anything unless they are alerted to the dangers, you say we have to move to that village... a village which has residency rules which would stop that.
Discussing it is fine. The point is that your audience is weak. Do you realize that most Americans don't vote? I would put the ex-JW group of non-voters at 90-95%. You are talking to people who, when it really comes down to it, don't seem to care.
Hasn't it hit any of you guys that we are apathetic? We are lazy? We are willing to let someone else make the rules ane when we don't like them, we come to places like this (or go to our neighbors and have a beer) and complain.
As average Americans, the only opportunity we have to make a difference is to vote. Too many don't. Then they sit back and whine about everything. Does not matter who is in office or what the current govs MO is. Someone is going to be unhappy.
When someone from overseas points out all the flaws of our system, without offering answers, it is frustrating. Everyone knows the flaws and the problems. Talking about it and pointing it out endlessly is not going to effect change. Come up with solutions. Post the answers to the problems that you all love to point out.
Since our politictians can't seem to find the answers, maybe you guys do have them. If you do, tell someone. Tell us. Some of us do vote and care.
My invitation to come to America and effect change is true. If Arnold S. can come, marry a Kennedy, while being a staunch republican, anything can happen.
I just don't see answers, just an endless stream of *one more thing that is wrong with/we don't like/why the world hates you*.
why aren't pro-war people signing up for the army and going to fight? Why aren't you doing something?
Many, many Americans signed up after 9/11. In droves.
I cannot because I am too old and I have epilepsy. Having a grand-mal seizure while holding a machine gun might not be the best way to make friends in boot camp-
educate others about what we each believe and think. You are wrong when you say that public opinion and expression and even protest does nothing - any politician ignoring such things will discover it is folly.
The spirit of the *discussions* here is not to educate; it is to irritate. Everyone knows that. That is why so many people stay out of the discussions.
Also, as noted in my post above, politicians in America could give a rats ass what a group of ex-JWs think. With the voter apathy at an all time low, the last thing a politician is going to pay attention to is a group of non-voting, former (or current) pacifists.
The politicians go with the polls. What is the current opinion poll saying. That is what they care about. If you get lucky enough to be screwed somehow by a local or state gov, you give yourself a forum to start with. It is very tough for the average person to be heard.
why don't you move over here and vote to have my rights removed.I don't want to change your country. If my country is hurting your country, tell your politicians. Tony Blair will take a beating, just like GW, regarding WMD. If they don't find any.
I thought this bit from Mark Morford of the San Francisco Gate was hilarious and closer to the truth about Bush's efforts to "free" the people of Iraq. What a gas!
Bush Repeatedly Slaps Self In Face With Dead Fish
President Bush shot back Tuesday at those suggesting his snide warmongering CEO administration inflated prewar intelligence data on Iraq's weapons program. He said the most important fact was that "the people of Iraq are free." He actually said that. He actually came right out and had the goddamn nerve to smirk and grumble and say it was all about "liberating" a deeply oppressed people, like that's ever been our motive, and not about WMD, or nukes, or terrorism, or any sort of actual threat to the U.S., or anything whatsoever having to do with any of the goddamn reasons his prick-ass war-drunk powermad administration led this nation into a violent ugly murderous ongoing war in the first place, and if by "free" he means Iraq is now operating in a near police state, in utter and violent chaos, gangs in the streets, hospitals barely functioning, clean water almost nonexistent, businesses shattered, the city shot completely to hell, increasing Iraqi resentment at U.S. presence and failed "nation-building", rogue Iraqi factions still killing U.S. soldiers (and vice-versa), hatred of the U.S. in all Muslim nations at an all-time high, and Cheney's cronies over at Halliburton gleefully snorting up U.S. taxpayer millions like fine Peruvian cocaine, well, he's absolutely right, that simpering dink.
President Bush shot back Tuesday at those suggesting his snide warmongering CEO administration inflated prewar intelligence data on Iraq's weapons program.
This brings up another question:
Who or what type of person makes the best politician? Should it be a career politician? Should it be a former judge or prosecutor? A businessman/woman?
When I read "CEO Administration" I take that negatively. However, a CEO is responsible to shareholders and employees for the health of the corporation. They know how to spin.
A judge of prosecutor knows the laws; would that make them a good politician?
More and more our politicians are attorneys and then become politicians when they can afford to run for office. Since I think attorneys are the sleaziest of the sleazy, I think that is bad.
So, who has the answer? I have not heard from Realist, Searchforthetruth, Pleasuredome, Trauma Hound (who is running for office according to a previous post....he needs to tell us which so we can all help-).
"No matter who the President is and whether or not you agree with them, you should show respect to someone in that office."
As I mentioned the other day, this is often one of the defining characteristic of American nationalism; slack-jawed respect for the President. He's the head of a democracy, not god's ordained. If you DO want a Royal Family, borrow one of ours, Edward's going spare...
Discussing it is fine. The point is that your audience is weak. Do you realize that most Americans don't vote? I would put the ex-JW group of non-voters at 90-95%. You are talking to people who, when it really comes down to it, don't seem to care.
Of course I realise that most Americans don’t vote – I’m also more informed about your country’s immigration policy than you! And if people don’t care, why are these threads so popular? Where do you get your stats from? The same place as your arguments (really teenyuck, I disagree with your politics, but think you’re quite a reasoned poster; I am flabbergasted your idea about what non-Americans should do was so facile)?
Hasn't it hit any of you guys that we are apathetic? We are lazy? We are willing to let someone else make the rules ane when we don't like them, we come to places like this (or go to our neighbors and have a beer) and complain.
Yes, which is why I used those adjectives, and which why talking to the people who live their might actually, occasionally, seep through.
When someone from overseas points out all the flaws of our system, without offering answers, it is frustrating.
I think that America trying to regain some respect in the International arena is quite simple, and answers have been given in abundance. Don’t lie. Don’t get caught with your hands in the till. Set an example. Be even handed with Israel and Palestine. Don’t support despots and dictators to keep the strategic balance in the USA’s favour; you are a democracy, it’s not fitting. Don’t show contempt for international law. Help the UN achieve some credibility. Don’t be hypocritical. So your characterisation that no answers are given is wrong.
Everyone knows the flaws and the problems.
Wrong. People deny facts here; Yeru still cannot bring himself to admit that the USA has backed terrorists he is so in thrall of his patriotism. People believe that the Bush administartion was not aware of the flawed nature of the evidence regarding WoMD, largely due to the slack-jawed trust in Presidents (don't you guys DO history at school?).
Talking about it and pointing it out endlessly is not going to effect change. Come up with solutions. Post the answers to the problems that you all love to point out.
Like I say, even when the answers are not explicitly stated, the answers are obvious, if you think they aren’t there, you’re not looking, or not thinking. Example (using home affairs); Death Penalty ineffective and liable to error and injustice? Don’t execute criminals!
My invitation to come to America and effect change is
… worthless, as you can't just waft off to the USA?
Face it teeny; you really, really, really didn’t think this through.
Your argument regarding US citizens is perfect. Vote you €uckers!
Your argument concerning non-Americans was just plain dumb, and you pretending that no solutions are ever provided is a distortion of the facts.
I think that America trying to regain some respect in the International arena is quite simple, and answers have been given in abundance. Don’t lie. Don’t get caught with your hands in the till. Set an example. Be even handed with Israel and Palestine. Don’t support despots and dictators to keep the strategic balance in the USA’s favour; you are a democracy, it’s not fitting. Don’t show contempt for international law. Help the UN achieve some credibility. Don’t be hypocritical. So your characterisation that no answers are given is wrong.
I agree with all of those. Problem is most countries are doing the same thing. The USA is not the only western country who needs your advice.
don't you guys DO history at school?
No, not much. We are making history so politically correct, they are changing names of stuff so as not to offend the people that landed here...and the people that were here. Really messed up. Glad I don't have kids.
largely due to the slack-jawed trust in Presidents
That went down with Kennedy. Now we find out even he was not a god-
I don't trust any politician. I don't care what party, male or female. They all lie. Our political system is really messed up. It is true: The people with the money make the rules. They have the money to be elected and they end up making the rules.
I have a tendancy to vote republican because I am sick to death of large government and taxes. Taking more and more to spend more and more is insane. It is similar to the credit situation so many find themselves in. You get the flyer, fill it out and Voila! New card and new line of credit. Bad idea.
I want my taxes to build roads & bridges, the military and local police, some aid for poor people, education and few other social programs. Student loans are good. Low interest (mine were 10% 20 years ago, they are now 3%) loans for people to purchase homes. Things like that.
That seems to be a thing of the past.
Yeru is unique. He was never a JW. He is a military man. By signing up for the military, he swore to a code of conduct, which includes doing what he is told, even if he does not agree with the politics. I admire him and all who volunteer for service. No matter the reason, the fact remains, they can be sent somewhere and die. Or die in training. It is tough work and deserves our support.
This is a large country that really tries to accomodate everyone. In spite of the Patriot Act, we are very free to go about our lives. With 290 million people spread out so far, there are going to be problems.
Voting is one way to use my tiny voice.
Regarding Arnold: He is probably going to run for governor of California. There is a recall vote on for the current gov, Gray Davis. He is the guy they blame for the power outages (all linked to Enron BTW). The republicans are not supporting this. They think it is better to wait it out. Let him be voted out of office. The people in California are doing this, with the backing of a guy who made his fortune (yes, he is wealthy) on car alarms.
He is a poster child for someone coming here, who can never be president, yet who can get elected and effect change.
BTW, your debates are balanced and sincere. Some of the other posters here get very hostile during these talks. Except for a few *dumbs* you handle things very well. Thanks.
I have never met a person that procceds from such a number of false assumptions as you do. I would like to recommend a book to you:
Extraordinary Popular Delusions (& the Madness of Crowds).
Wake up.
Your continuing "Ad Populum" argument is getting old, the facts, as well as history has proven you wrong, over and over.
You are a true Bourgeoisophobe
http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/001/102gwtnf.asp
teenyuck,
Sure looks to me like your doing the same as everyone else, Oh thats right your a republican so I guess that makes you rightoues and perfect. Hold on a minute while I go give birth to a Bush supporter then I will wipe my teenyuck and flush it down the toilet. Your just as ignorant as I thought...
