Question for believers, heaven or earth?

by Tornintwo 28 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Tornintwo

    Just trying to figure out what I believe in the wake of leaving the Borg. Jesus message appeals, of course. I just wanted to ask believers, Christians, on this forum if you think the hope is heaven or earth. Reading the gospels the heavenly hope comes through stronger. But then how to you explain scriptures such as ?

    'meek will inherit the earth', 'thy will be done on earth...' Daniel 2:44, rev 21:3,4 etc.

    i always treasured the paradise earth hope, not so much for myself, but for the desire to see the earth cleansed of pollution and nature no longer threatened with destruction by greedy mankind, but I realize now that the concept that animals will change their dietary habits, with all of the consequences that has for natural life cycles, is farfetched. Also how are humans going to live without sinning with all of their inherent natural desires, if in the 'new system' young Johnny and Jane hook up, will they get zapped instantly or stoned by the survivors of armageddon? Doesn't sound much like a paradise to me.

    your thoughts would be welcome please...

    atheists, if you must post on this thread please be nice!

  • Bonsai
    You forgot the third option for believers: HELL
  • LoisLane looking for Superman
    LoisLane looking for Superman

    TornN2, My life did not begin until I left WT. I am doing what I want and I wanted to live on a beautiful paradise earth with the animals, kind people and meet my resurrected relatives, from way back.

    So, what I am doing, is, I live in beautiful surroundings of my choice. Every day I am happy and free. Yesterday, Baby Dear, a sweet wild deer born 2 years ago, came by with her son. Last year, she came up to our kitchen window (we call it the take out window) and we fed her pieces of apple on the end of a chop stick through the open window. Yesterday, they both ate apple pieces together. So sweet!

    Slowly but surely I am learning about the history of my relatives. I am rather impressed. I would like to meet them in person, as I was promised by WT/GB but honestly, that is a pipe dream. For JW's, that is the carrot WT holds out for sheeple in exchange for free labor and money from their innocent victims pockets. The GB has the 'gold' and makes the 'rules'. The sheeples are their slaves to their bidding. That is all. Plain and simple.

    There is no Big A. There is no paradise earth. There is no eternal life with eternal perfect health. There is no Santa Claus and no Easter Bunny. Sorry. You were lied to.

    Have you read anything on JWFacts?

    All the very best to you and your family as you find what you really want in this life and go get it.


    (Sorry this is so long).

  • LoisLane looking for Superman
    LoisLane looking for Superman

    Getting back to your OP.

    My suggestion: Live your life as you want, what makes you happy. If you die (when you die) if something happens after that, well then, Surprise! but I wouldn't hold my breath. (Pun intended).


  • Bonsai

    I realize my comment was a bit cheeky, but for the majority of Christians on this planet hell is a very real thing that they believe and fear. We can't just cherry pick the good outcomes and forget about the bad ones.

    That being said, although I am more atheistic than not, I wish their was a heavenly and earthly paradise for all. I'd wish it for you and for everyone else who can live peacefully with their fellow human brethren. Unfortunately, I don't see either as a reality to get my hopes up over.

    Also I recall reading somewhere that "meek will inherit the earth" can be translated also as "land" as in Jerusalem. The scripture wasn't originally meant to mean a paradise earth.

  • The Searcher
    The Searcher

    Christ's "equivalent" ransom sacrifice - by definition, logic, and scriptural reasoning - does not, and cannot allow for an elite group to graduate to heavenly immortality to become king/priests, - Melchizedek-types - a description only applied to, and unique to Christ! (Hebrews chapters 5,6, & 7)

    e.g. Hebrews 5:10 - "....because he (not 144,000) has been specifically called by God a high priest according to the manner of Melchizedek."

    The actual meaning of the word used - "ransom" - has gone straight over most J.W.'s heads, and they don't even hear themselves when they "witness" to people that "Christ's ransom will buy back what was lost by Adam & Eve."

    So some of Adam & Eve's offspring were destined for heaven, as king/priests? That's what was was lost in Eden?

    For "believers" - have a listen to the former Bishop of Durham - now a professor at St. Andrews University in Scotland. At the very least, watch from 15mins. 45 secs. for about 10 mins.

    You won't hear such riveting speakers at J.W. events!

  • mommyfirstandalways

    I have been wondering the same thing as I am trying to figure out my belief system. My problem is that now I doubt the Bible. Different cultures have different sacred books so which one had the truth. Maybe they are all just helpful guides that man has twisted and even sacrificed and killed for. Not to mention they were written in such different times by people who believed it was okay to have more than one wife and that it was okay to have slaves and stoned people to death.

    So for now I only take the good out of it like imitating good qualities to be a good person and am finally living my life how I want to live it without worrying about all the pressure of living up to other people's norms. We will all die one day and I think if I open my eyes again I will be thankful. I Def do not believe in hell! That's about all I can say.

  • Tornintwo

    Thanks for replies so far, searcher I will watch with interest later on.

    Mommyfirstandalways.... I agree with you - I am very confused about the God of the OT and am starting to have doubts about the scriptures and their purpose... But, I do find the message and example of Christ very appealing and worthy of following (even if you don't believe in God) but I do believe, it might sound simplistic but I look at life and and nature & I believe there must be some more powerful force behind it, so I guess I am still searching for answers.

    I think if I was creator I would be proud of the emerging humanistic 'new morality' where respect for and equality of gender, race, and sexuality is more important than controlling people or their sex lives. Where murder is a worse sin than adultery (whereas in the OT murder was sanctioned in the case of adultery). I wouldn't want to punish anyone with death or hellfire if they happen to have the wrong religious views by accident of birth.

    So yeah, I'm confused - Keep those answers coming!

  • Hisclarkness
    Check out I'm sure you will find your answers there.
  • PlatinumFix
    I appreciate everyone has a view/opinion Tornintwo but "Where murder is a worse sin than adultery" - Adultery can murder others mentally i.e the innocent/hurt party - perhaps that's a bit drastic but you catch my drift.

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