Why is he spiritual Israel not innumerable?

by Salomo 15 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • waton
    not that the WTS considers them as having an earthly hope.

    Vdh, The confused wt doctrine is, that on one hand

    a) they write in such a way that the 144 000 are the 12 tribes, exclusively they only, the wt "anointed" partakers. but

    when confronted with texts that say "you ( the future anointed ) will rule the 12 tribes of Israel, wt writers will says:

    b) the 12 tribes of Israel in the NT are all those not of the 144 000. i.e. those with an earthly hope. This agrees with reading of Rev. 7, where the 144 k come out of the 12 tribes. (all anointed are first of all, start out as "of the earthly class", the apostles, even Jesus*)

    The confusion, fostered by the gb, comes from the insistence by wt, that the Israel of God are exclusively no other than the 144 thousand. , the chosen.the sealed.

    We at heavies are the chosen, and you are not!

    wt teaches 2 Israels of god. :" confuse and rule ". confusion is the wt rule.

    Now, if only there really was a talking snake. it would matter.

    * Jesus, the second Adam, gave up his right to his earthly hope, and so have the "anointed" partakers. Partaking bestows the right to everlasting life on Earth. John 6.

  • Salomo

    The old covenant had firstborns and secondborns. Therefore, the new covenant has firstborns and secondborns too. And they have different functions in the kingdom of god. Because the gb did not realize it, the result is confusion. But if you understand this, the whole thing becomes clear.

    After the first great crowd in heaven was praising god by itself, a second great crowd praises god on earth, by request (Rev 19:1-8, compare with Rev 5:13; 11:13; 7:10).

    And if you compare Rev 7:13-17 with Rev 21:2-4 and Rev 22:14, you see the tent, the bride is coming down and is covering the great crowd or the great crowd can enter into the New Jerusalem, after it was coming down on Earth. This tent or the city of the 144,000 is the temple in which the great crowd is serving god (1Cor 3:16).

    And with the question, why is the spiritual seed of Abraham not innumerable, I hope to change the view. But I need help. As more ask the question, as sooner things will change.

  • JoenB75

    The whole distinguishing between earthly and heavenly Hope is due to Russell and Rutherfords speculations. Russell imagined that those running for the high calling would receive the nature of Jehovah if their works were approved. Such an honour could not be bestowed upon any ol Joe and thus the idea of two classes was needed. We should not derive our doctrine from speculations about such difficult text as revelation. According to 1 Tim 4v10, Jesus Christ is the saviour of all, especially believers. The information concerning the salvation of the unbeliever and the devils is unclear and clouded, we are only told of the ultimate purpose (Colossians 1:20).

  • RolRod

    In THE FINISHED MYSTERY, they even numbered the Great Crowd, which no man was able to number LOL

  • Salomo

    I just send my question to Bethel. Now we will see, what Jehovah is doing in this case.

  • RubaDub

    Perhaps the one counting only has 144,000 fingers and toes. Jesus would be the thumb.

    So we end up with the 144,001 number we have read about many times.

    Not rocket science.

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