A JW explains Blood Fractions

by OrphanCrow 49 Replies latest watchtower medical

  • possum
    possum

    Why not? Why should JWs just take, take, take and not be obligated to give anything back? In Australia people don't get paid to donate blood it's dependent on the good will of the community/world. That world JWs are so quick to condemn and at the same time selfishly use to the full.

  • eyeuse2badub
    eyeuse2badub

    BLOOD FRACTIONS! LOL---LOL---LOL

    It's the old "strain out the gnat but gulp down the camel" line of reasoning. So in the future will it be okay for dubs to smoke just "fractions" of a joint?

    JUST SAYING!

  • OrphanCrow
    OrphanCrow
    Possum: Hemophiliac preparations (Factor VIII and IX)(Approved): It takes about 9000 kilograms of whole blood to make one 0.1 gram dose of Factor VIII. A person suffering from severe hemophilia typically requires several doses a year.
    The Watchtower Society is not ignorant of this:
    More than 250,000 blood donations are required annually to produce the factor VIII, and factor IX that is consumed by the Jehovah’s Witness community. Huge vats could be filled with all of the human blood that is stored and processed to meet the needs of Witness Hemophiliacs.The Watchtower ignores these facts when explaining why it allows use of these “small fractions,” but cynically emphasizes them when it uses AIDS as propaganda against blood transfusions.
    Each batch of Factor VIII is made from plasma that is pooled from as many as 2,500 blood donors.” (The Watchtower, June 15, 1985, p. 30)

    Dr. Margaret Hilgartner of the New York Hospital-Cornell Medical Center said: “A severe hemophiliac is exposed to the blood of 800,000 to 1 million different people every year.”” (Awake! Oct. 8, 1988, p. 11)

    More than 250,000 blood donations are required annually to produce the factor VIII, and factor IX that is consumed by the Jehovah’s Witness community. Huge vats could be filled with all of the human blood that is stored and processed to meet the needs of Witness Hemophiliacs.The Watchtower ignores these facts when explaining why it allows use of these “small fractions,” but cynically emphasizes them when it uses AIDS as propaganda against blood transfusions.

    The information you posted is somewhat out of date. Note that the WT quotes are from the 80s.

    The developments in blood medicine since that time have led to both factor vii and factor ix being genetically engineered, which it is called "recombinant" factor viii/xi.These fractions are now made from the cells of hamster kidneys. Most Western countries prefer to use this source rather than plasma for these clotting factors and it is recombinant factor vii and factor ix that is most often used - and of course, preferred by the JWs.

    How are factor VIII and IX concentrates made?
    Factor VIII and IX concentrates can be divided into two categories:
    • recombinant, genetically engineered factor VIII and IX
    • plasma-derived factor VIII and IX.

    Recombinant, genetically engineered factor VIII and IX
    Recombinant, genetically engineered factor VIII and IX are not made from human plasma. They are made like this.
    • The human factor VIII (or IX) gene is isolated through genetic engineering. The gene contains the code which has instructions for the cell on how to make human factor VIII (or IX).
    • The gene is inserted into non-human cells, such as baby hamster kidney cells or Chinese hamster ovary cells.
    • These cells are grown in a cell culture. They produce factor VIII (or IX).
    • The factor VIII (or IX) is separated from the cell culture and purified.
    • Sucrose is then added to stabilize the final factor VIII (or IX) product.

    Plasma-derived factor VIII and IX
    Plasma-derived factor VIII and IX are made from human plasma. Plasma donations are pooled together in a pharmaceutical plant. Then, the plasma is separated into different products. This is called fractionation. The main products are:
    • albumin (to treat burns)
    • immune globulins (to treat problems of the immune system)
    • factor VIII (to treat hemophilia A)
    • factor IX (to treat hemophilia B).
    What are the blood products of choice for hemophilia A?
    Genetically engineered (recombinant) factor VIII is the clotting factor concentrate used by most Canadians with hemophilia A. It has been the product of choice since being introduced in 1993. The brand names used in Canada are Advate®, Kogenate®FS and Xyntha®. In Quebec, Eloctate®, an extended half-life product, was introduced in 2015 for patients with specific needs.
    Plasma-derived factor VIII is sometimes used in particular situations for the treatment of hemophilia A: 1) for previously untreated patients who may be at higher risk for the development of inhibitors and 2) for immune tolerance induction for patients who have already developed antibodies to factor VIII. Brand names used in Canada are Humate P® and Wilate®.
    What are the blood products of choice for hemophilia B?
    Recombinant factor IX, which goes under the brand name of Benefix® is the blood product used by most Canadians with hemophilia B. It was introduced in Canada on a regular basis in 1998. In Quebec, AlprolixTM, an extended half-life product, was introduced in 2015 for patients with specific needs.
    Plasma-derived factor IX is also used by Canadians with hemophilia B. The brand name used in Canada is ImmunineVH®.

    More information here:

    Factor replacement therapy

    So, now Jehovah's Witnesses can access clotting factors that has been manufactured from hamster cells and avoid the use of human plasma derived clotting factors.

    And this is why I was trying to find out the WT's position on the use of stem cells. I am curious how they will scripturally justify using the upcoming stem cell derived "artificial" blood that is about to enter into trials.

    It is odd that the WT views blood that was supposedly created by their Jehovah to be off limits (except for all those plasma derived blood products they have used for years before genetically engineered factors became possible) and yet what they approve is blood that is manufactured. Blood that tries (and fails) to do the same job that the god-created blood does.

    Whenever i have tried to discuss blood with JWs, they fall into the default position of saying "oh...but blood is a symbol of life" and my question to that is this: what does manufactured blood symbolize if not exactly the same thing? Why can it be used? Does not artificial blood and alternatives to blood symbolize life as well?


    smiddy: Doesnt the Bible say words to the effect that :
    "blood is not to be stored and that it is to be poured out on the ground " ?
    Doesnt that rule out collecting blood ,processing it in a laboratory into fractions ,then storing it again to be used at some later date by a Jehovahs Witness who refuses Blood products ?
    Just asking.

    Of course it does. And the WT's doctrine breaks that injunction all the time. It isn't a doctrine based on the Bible - it is a doctrine that they twist the scriptures to fit. Their "doctrine" arises outside of anything that could be considered "holy" and the WT has tried to disguise it as a "religious doctrine" when it is anything but.

    The only way that the WT can justify that they are following the bible scripture is if they claim that the blood used for fractions is the "blood poured on the altar"* rather than the blood spilled on the ground.

    *maybe they use blood "altar-natives"

  • OrphanCrow
    OrphanCrow

    Something I forgot to say about clotting factors.

    The information I posted about how those factors are made/sourced, comes from a hemophilia organization.

    However, those clotting factors are also used in surgical procedures. Especially so for Jehovah's Witnesses who elect "bloodless" procedures. Those fractions of blood, that help the blood to clot, are essential to bloodless surgery.

  • TD
    TD

    I skimmed it just now. It's about what you would expect from a person who doesn't understand the meaning of the word, "doctrine."

    The idea that "fractions" are no longer blood is unique to a loose knit group of dull witted internet apologists and is not actually the position taken by the JW parent organization.

  • OrphanCrow
    OrphanCrow
    pubsinger: Ask a JW if it's ok to be a blood donor? No blood fractions can be obtained without blood donation.

    It isn't just "blood fractions" that rely on a donor pool.

    So-called "artificial blood" also uses donor blood.

    Polyheme, approved by the WT (arranged by the HLC through "compassionate use"), is derived from expired human blood. The hemoglobin is removed, stored, processed, and turned into a manufactured blood product. And used on JW patients.

    Hemopure (now known under different names) is a bovine blood product. Made from the blood of donor cows. Herds of cows are raised in carefully controlled environments (apparently), and when they are slaughtered, their blood is drained, collected, cooled, and then processed to remove the hemoglobin. From that, WT approved "artificial" blood is made. And transfused into the veins of that "fraction" of the Jehovah's Witness community that will accept the added risk of using that kind of blood - animal blood that was not spilled upon the ground.

    Donate blood? Of course not. The JW community just sucks the blood of the world - in whatever form the WT tells them to - processed blood. They don't avoid blood - they avoid giving blood. They won't share their blood.

  • Crazyguy
    Crazyguy

    The most important thing to think about is how many JW woman are going to die at Armageddon because they breast fed their children? Breast milk contains roughly 1 million white blood cells per drop.

    In other parts of the world where the milk drank by JWs is not properly filtered to get rid of most of the white blood cells like they do in the US because it makes the milk thick and lumpy, how many men woman and children of the JW faith going to die during Jah 's judgment? I'm afraid a lot of JWs are going to die that day.

  • Vidiot
    Vidiot

    Personally, I suspect the fraction justifications that started out back in the 90s were really the Org's fumbly attempts to explain why many blood-related treatments (like Hemopure) had already been allowed, in response to some of the smarter rank-and-filers out there asking "why?"...

  • Vidiot
    Vidiot
    "A JW explains blood fractions..."

    I still think that the best analogy was "...forbidding the consumption of a BLT sandwich, but allowing the individual bread, bacon, lettuce, and tomato to be eaten separately..." (paraphrasing, but that's the gist).

    :smirk:

  • OrphanCrow
    OrphanCrow
    TD: The idea that "fractions" are no longer blood is unique to a loose knit group of dull witted internet apologists and is not actually the position taken by the JW parent organization.

    That could be.

    That is why the WT's blood doctrine is so dangerous. They have inconsistently applied an ancient directive to a group of people while at the same time, have used that doctrine to manipulate, and profit from, medical research that their "doctrine" has fostered.

    It is not surprising that some JWs, the true believers who need a "logical" explanation for something that is so illogical, come up with convoluted reasoning to make the WT seem reasonable. They have to. The WT has forced them into that position.

    If the "parent" WT does, then, acknowledge that "blood fractions" are still blood....then why is there a no blood doctrine at all? Why is blood still "banned"? Why do they still say that they refuse blood transfusions when they don't? Why don't they be honest and say..."we don't refuse blood transfusions...we just use special kinds of blood, and the special parts of blood"?

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