New NWT deception at Genesis 8:22 to indicate earth remains forever.

by jwfacts 48 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat

    johnamos if the author of Psalm 102 wished to say that the difference between God and the earth is that the earth could perish whereas God cannot perish, then he could have said so. Instead what he wrote was that the difference between God and the earth is that the earth will perish and God will remain. Just because it's only a difference of a single word doesn't give you the right to rewrite it to say what you wish it would say.

    You're right that the fact this verse addressed to Jehovah in the Psalms is applied to Jesus in Hebrews is an additional problem for JWs that I hadn't even mentioned.

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat
    And since you bring it up, the NWT has a declared policy of using "Jehovah" in the NT where it quotes an OT passage. Why was this policy not followed in Hebrews 1:10?
  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat

    Paul here is another change in the rNWT that has obviously been made for reasons other than simply greater readability. Narkissos mentioned this in his review of the revision.

    http://oudenologia.over-blog.com/article-the-new-new-world-translation-120916291.html



    1984 edition Numbers 31:18 And preserve alive for yourselves all the little ones among the women who have not known the act of lying with a male.

    2013 edition Numbers 31:18 But you may keep alive all the young girls who have not had sexual relations with a man.

  • johnamos
    johnamos
    if the author of Psalm 102 wished to say that the difference between God and the earth is that the earth could perish whereas God cannot perish, then he could have said so.

    Proverbs 2:3 if, moreover, you call out for understanding itself and you give forth your voice for discernment itself, 4 if you keep seeking for it as for silver, and as for hid treasures you keep searching for it, 5 in that case you will understand the fear of Jehovah, and you will find the very knowledge of God. 6 For Jehovah himself gives wisdom; out of his mouth there are knowledge and discernment.

    Proverbs 3: 13 Happy is the man that has found wisdom, and the man that gets discernment, 14 for having it as gain is better than having silver as gain and having it as produce than gold itself. 15 It is more precious than corals, and all other delights of yours cannot be made equal to it

    (James 1:5) So, if any one of YOU is lacking in wisdom, let him keep on asking God, for he gives generously to all and without reproaching; and it will be given him.

    (Philippians 1:9) And this is what I continue praying, that YOUR love may abound yet more and more with accurate knowledge and full discernment;

    (2 Timothy 2:7) Give constant thought to what I am saying; the Lord will really give you discernment in all things.

    discernment: the quality of being able to grasp and comprehend what is obscure

    doesn't give you the right to rewrite it to say what you wish it would say.

    I suppose that those that want to interpret any and all writings that give the impression that ‘the earth will perish’ have the right to ignore any and all writings that give the impression that the earth will remain forever with the righteous themselves residing on it.

    the NWT has a declared policy of using "Jehovah" in the NT where it quotes an OT passage. Why was this policy not followed in Hebrews 1:10?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darby_Bible

    In the Old Testament Darby translates the covenant name of God as "Jehovah" instead of rendering it "LORD" or "GOD" (in all capital letters) as most English translations do. Among other widely used translations only Robert Young's Literal Translation, the American Standard Version (1901), and the Jehovah's Witnesses' New World Translation (1950) have followed this practice. The footnotes of many editions (such as the 1961 Modified Notes Edition) of Darby Bible's New Testament indicate where "Lord" ("Kurios" in Greek) in the scripture text probably refers to Jehovah. The 1961 Modified Notes Edition of the Darby Bible includes the 1871 New Testament Preface, which says in part "All the instances in which the article is wanting before Kurios are not marked by brackets; but I give here all the passages in which Kurios, which the LXX employ for Jehovah, thence transferred to the New Testament, is used as a proper name; that is, has the sense of 'Jehovah.'" It then gives a listing of those places.

  • slimboyfat
    slimboyfat
    I suppose that those that want to interpret any and all writings that give the impression that ‘the earth will perish’ have the right to ignore any and all writings that give the impression that the earth will remain forever with the righteous themselves residing on it.

    It's not a matter of that. Some verses of the Bible say the earth will perish and others say it will last forever. The problems arise when believers insist the Bible must be consistent with itself. In order to uphold this belief they have to deny the meaning of those verses that contradict their favoured teaching.

    But the plain meaning of Psalm 102 remains clear: the earth will perish.

  • James Mixon
    James Mixon

    The difference between "forever" and "eternal"

    The Hebrew word in both is the same Olam which means "age lasting or

    the end of the age. The earth will last until it reaches the end of it's age which

    God has established.

    EX. 12;14 A feast for the Lord throughout your generation as a statue forever.

    Lev.23:41 You shall celebrate it as a feast to my Lord for seven days in the years. It is

    a statute forever throughout your generation.

  • johnamos
    johnamos
    But the plain meaning of Psalm 102 remains clear: the earth will perish.


    OK then, if that is what your discernment tells you, I just hope that I am on the earth when it perishes…rather it is due to being one that made it through the GT or was due to being a resurrected one after the GT.

  • jwfacts
    jwfacts
    Johnamos, I gave a link that discusses the OT Scriptures you refer to. They are recognized even by Watchtower as being poetic of the Jews. Shame you couldn't bother reading it.
  • jwfacts
    jwfacts
    On another note, so this thread isn't completely hijacked, how do you feel about Watchtower changing the wording of Genesis 8:22 from its intended point, in order to prop up a JW doctrine?
  • johnamos
    johnamos
    they are recognized even by Watchtower

    how do you feel about Watchtower changing the wording of Genesis 8:22 from its intended point, in order to prop up a JW doctrine

    First, I don’t know what point there is in you letting me know what is recognized by the WT as if that means anything to me…I am not a JW nor ever was. As far as how do I feel about them changing wording to prop up their doctrine…well I view the WTS/GB as to how the stupid prophets are described in Ezekiel 13. There they are said to have ‘spoken untruth and have visioned a lie’ and are charged with leading God’s people astray…so it would not surprise me for them to change any wording to support their false teachings. That is part of the whitewash plastering that they must do to continue to prop up their doctrine.

    That being said, you are speaking to someone who is under the impression that the earth will remain forever and that is from my own reading of the bible, it is not based on JW doctrine. So here in this case I would agree with their rendering of that verse or at least I do not have a issue with it.

    In any case, the translations that you supplied in no way put forth the notion that you said here:

    give the impression that the earth will have a finite existence.

    makes it appear that Genesis 8:22 indicates the earth will never cease…despite the passage indicating the opposite when translated correctly.

    But anyway as I said to SBF, I just hope that I am on the earth when it perishes/ceases to exist…rather it is due to being one that made it through the GT or was due to being a resurrected one after the GT.

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