Did Russell come up with the no hell fire and no Trinity doctrine or did steal that belief from another religion as well?

by nowwhat? 43 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • sparky1

    "Russell believed what he taught." So what? Sincerity of character doesn't make the lies that he taught any more palpable or acceptable. As a young boy, I knew two people that had association with him; they thought he was the most kindly and humble person that they had ever met. Pastor Russell is one link in a progressive chain of god deluded religious fanatics trying to save the world as self appointed do-gooders. (My opinion of Russell in no way is a critique of your mothers work)

  • vienne

    If something is sincerely stated, it does not make the thoughts accurate. But it does not make them a lie. It makes them wrong, which Russell frequently was. Words matter. If we want to be effective, we must use them as intended. Otherwise we violate grammar conventions and are nothing more than a misleading polemicist. That defeats our claims. It is reason for others to shrug their shoulders and think us illiterate.

    My mom would have told you the Latin phrase that covers that aspect of false reasoning. I'm just telling you that your terms are wrong, grammatically speaking. If we misidentify, then we lose an argument.

  • eyeuse2badub


    You refer to CT as a "true believer". OMG the world if full of "true believers"! Charlatans can also be "true believers". I'm very familiar with old CT and his life. I'm 73 and a 3rd gen jw. My grand ma knew him and loved him. My mom knew of him and loved him. I grew up loving him because I didn't know about all the falsehood and delusional stuff CT "truly believed"! Religious people love their 'spiritual' leaders. That's why they fall for their bullsh*t!

    Never read about old CT making an apology for any of his imaginary "end of the world" predictions that he believed in!

    just saying!

  • sparky1

    lie noun (2)

    1b: an untrue or inaccurate statement that may or may not be believed true by the speaker or writer.- Merriam-Webster online dictionary

    You are correct. Words matter. Sincere or not PASTOR RUSSELL TAUGHT LIES.

    "I'm just telling you that your terms are wrong, grammatically speaking." Your statement is factually incorrect; however I don't have the formal education to conjure up a Latin phrase to buttress my position.

  • vienne

    You still mis-define Charlatan, but I don't see any reason to continue to debate that. I just see him as 'wrong' on many issues, especially in his view of women.

    The American side of my family has its share of Watch Tower adherents from the Russell era, some mentioned in Zion's Watch Tower. My mom rejected Witness belief, and though my Austrian-born gramma converted to Witness belief, my mom did not follow her into that folly.

  • sparky1

    "You still mis-define Charlatan."- Anastasia

    No he doesn't.

    charlatan noun

    2 : one making usually showy pretenses to knowledge or ability - Merriam-Webster online dictionary

    Pastor Russell wrote thousands of articles, magazines, books, tracts, etc., etc., in order to bring to 'ignorant mankind' his amalgamated and contrived version of biblical truth so as to point them to the way of salvation as he saw it. His sincerity does not preclude him being a charlatan.

  • RolRod

    Russell never claimed to invent anything, and often stated he borrowed from others.

  • blondie

    Russell said he was going out there and gathering the one or two "truths" that some religions had "saved" to be gathered into one place again when Jesus came back to take possession of the kingdom. He said he was only looking for the people who would really be ruling with Christ in heaven.

    There was no push to find or convert non-anointed people because soon (1914) god would end wickedness, government infrastructure, commercial infrastructure and religious infrastructure, the big three (trinity?). Then the ordinary people on earth would be ushered into god's kingdom on earth as defined by the WTS.


    THE present world system under Satan’s control has three principal elements that are manipulated by “the god of this world.” These are political rulership, big business control and influence, and religion. Over the millenniums of history, these three factors have been the constants of virtually every ruling system. Which of these powerful forces is symbolized by “the mother of the harlots”?​—2 Corinthians 4:3, 4, The Jerusalem Bible; Revelation 12:9; 17:5.


    However, Satan’s world does not follow righteous principles. Corruption abounds. It is to be found in religion, in politics​—and in big business.

  • cofty

    In the early days Russell advised those who subscribed to his writings to stay in whatever church they were currently associated with. He said that no organisation had monopoly on truth and that Christ would know his sheep wherever they were to be found.

    Those are not the actions of a man who was seeking to set himself up as a leader. If only he had stuck to those principles.

  • blondie

    Good point, cofty.

    Evidently the "adulation" of his followers went to his head.

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