We have close friends who secretly became JW's. Now that they are "out" they say that war is wrong and our son shouldn't join the military. We know that war is not what God wants, however, we need scripture to back defending our country and protecting our loved ones. I've been reading and can't come up with really good verses. They also told us that holidays are man-made. So? Does that make it wrong to celebrate birthdays, etc. Evidently, having certain parties to celebrate what they deem okay is fine. Anyone with scriptures to help us? Thanks. (I find this to be the most mesmerizing site to sit and read. I could spend hours.)
Scripture to Back Beliefs
by Gritsgirl 29 Replies latest watchtower bible
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funkyderek
We know that war is not what God wants, however, we need scripture to back defending our country and protecting our loved ones
Cornelius was a centurion in the Roman army. He was able to receive holy spirit and to be baptized by Peter. There is no indication that he ever had to leave his post. (Acts 10)
They also told us that holidays are man-made. So? Does that make it wrong to celebrate birthdays, etc. Evidently, having certain parties to celebrate what they deem okay is fine.
There are no biblical prohibitions on birthdays. The average JW will point to what they claim are the only references to birthdays in the Bible, at both of which someone was beheaded. There are scriptures to suggest that Job's children celebrated their birthdays (not sure exactly where) and Jesus' birth was celebrated with gifts.
Watchtower publications ususally talk vaguely of pagan origins and giving undue honour to a person. That would make some sense if they didn't celebrate wedding anniversaries. Ask a JW for scriptural reasons why they don't celebrate birthdays. Ask them why the same reasoning doesn't apply to wedding anniversaries. Ask them why the Watchtower Society celebrated it's 100th birthday in 1979.
Hope this helps.
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Stephanus
Hmmmm. An newbie who says she's an outsider who finds JW logic compelling. Keep talking, "Gritsgirl"...
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Gritsgirl
Yes, thanks. This does help. JW's have some very different beliefs. Also, our friends will drink when they are with certain friends and not with others. But I guess that's for another forum. - Thanks again.
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pomegranate
each to his/her own conscience...
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Bosho
Hi funkyderek!
I'm sure there's a forum here somewhere ! But I'm too lazy to search!
Can you tell me more about this 100th Birthday do for the WBTS?
Thanks a deal!
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MikeMusto
Hello Gritsgirl,
I am an active JW.
On the principle of Jesus being love..and his words of perishing by the
sword.. I would believe that War is wrong. ..There is also no indication that
Cornelius stayed an officer of the military.
The holidays and celebrations your friends no longer celebrate are unscriptural.
But so are many other things the JW's do..wedding rings..anniversaries.
There is no scriptural basis for NOT celebrating these things
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NeonMadman
Here's some information I posted a while back on the Watchtower's teaching on "neutrality," which would include their position on military service:
I believe that their motivation for insisting upon political neutrality of their members is twofold. First, it provides a good supply of martyrs and makes them stand out in the public eye as being "different," when they are "persecuted" for such things as not serving in the military, not voting, not saluting the flag, etc. Second, time devoted to political activity is time not spent in the service of the cult masters. They'd rather have the drones out soliciting donations.
I find it interesting that their entire position of political neutrality is essentially built upon one scripture, John 17:14-16, where Jesus declares that his followers are "no part of the world," even as he is "no part of the world." However, the context does not indicate in any way that these words are a reference to involvement in government and politics. Rather, Jesus appears to be talking about the sinfulness of the world, and is asking God to protect his followers from succumbing to it. He speaks of his "protecting" them and of their being "sanctified".
Meanwhile, Israel as a nation fought in wars, and was still approved by God. There is no indication in scripture that Cornelius ceased to serve as a Roman soldier after his conversion. Paul used military illustrations on several occasions in his writing, an odd thing to do if military service was a grave sin. Paul also told us in Romans 13 to be obedient to the civil authorities, and that they were ordained by God. And, in 2 Tim. 1,2, he tells us to pray for these kings and other authorities. All of this conflicts with the Watchtower teaching of complete neutrality, and, really, there is not one scripture in the Bible that supports that teaching
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NeonMadman
The holidays and celebrations your friends no longer celebrate are unscriptural.
But so are many other things the JW's do..wedding rings..anniversaries.
There is no scriptural basis for NOT celebrating these things
HUH???!!!
Let me get this straight:
Christmas, which has some pagan origins, is "unscriptural".
Thanksgiving, which has no pagan origins, but is a national holiday, is "unscriptural".
Mothers Day, which has no pagan origins, and is not a national holiday in the sense of honoring the government, but which was, in fact, founded partially to encourage obedience to the fifth commandment, is "unscriptural".
But wedding rings and wedding anniversaries, which definitely have pagan origins, are OK because there is no basis in scripture for NOT celebrating them?
Are you drunk or delerious today, Mike? Are you feeling ill?
If not, I eagerly await the scriptural basis for these assertions. I want to see the scriptures that say that Thanksgiving and Mother's Day are unacceptable for Christians, but that wedding anniversaries are OK.
PLEASE, show me those scriptures!!!
And while you're looking them up, you might want to saunter over to Romans 14 and read the only chapter in the Bible that directly addresses the celebration of holidays by Christians:
Romans 14:4-6: Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand. One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord. He who eats meat, eats to the Lord, for he gives thanks to God; and he who abstains, does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God.
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NeonMadman
There is also no indication that Cornelius stayed an officer of the military.
Sorry, Mike, it doesn't work. Cornelius was a military officer. On a single occasion, Peter preached to him and his family. They were immediately converted (BTW, how come JW's today need long periods of study to be converted, when this was never the case in the Bible?). The holy spirit fell upon them, and they were baptized. All in one day.
If your assertion is that Cornelius subsequently resigned from the military, the burden of proof for that statement is on you. There is no indication anywhere that Cornelius left the military, or that he was expected to. Obviously, he was accepted for baptism while still an active military officer, which would never be done by Jehovah's Witnesses today. So, at the very least, we can unequivocally demonstrate that the practices of JW's today are not in harmony with the example set by the first century Christians.
Now, you can believe whatever you want about Cornelius' actions after his conversion. But if you expect us to believe that he left the military, then you are adding a concept to the Bible that is clearly not contained there. If you want to do that, you are required to offer substantial proof for your assertions.