by rabotnik 41 Replies latest social relationships
Hello out there!
New here. Are there any former JWs who have come out as gay or lesbian? If so, were you disfellowshipped? And how did your family react? If they disowned you -- did you find any support outside?
Wondering ... and teetering on a jagged edge,
rabotnik
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That must have been difficult for you, so what happened? Im hetero but have some gay freinds, jws are homophobes. lol
Interesting post Rabotnik,
I am defenitely hetero, but my ex-husband who is still a witness, imo, is a latent homosexual. He is a very frustrated and unhappy man.
I have often wondered how he would be if he just let go of the WT and became what he truly is.
Unfortuately he is re-married to another JW.
TW
Can I ask, what is natural about homosexuality?
If it is natural, why did Jehovah condemn it?
The Greek scriptures too talk about unnatural desires such as homosexuality.
rabotnik,
There used to be a newsletter published be a group of xJWs who are gay, but I haen't seen it for years. There also is a person who posts here who might be gay, based on his web site conntent. Perhaps you should supply an e mail address for any who would wish to contact you.
Hello Logical:
First, let me say your post brought to mind a quote by Albert Einstein: "It's wise to make things simple. But dangerous to make things more simple than they are."
You ask, "what is natural about homosexuality?" One can look up the definition of "natural" in a quality dictionary. Let me see: Homosexuality is "present or produced by nature .... Not acquired, inherent .... Not produced or changed artificially; not conditioned ...." All of those definitions of "natural" are quite apt.
Then you ask, "If it is natural, why did Jehovah condemn it?" Of course, you bring at least two presumptions to this question. One, the idea of "Jehovah" (with all the convuluted baggage that contains); and, two, that he "condemns" it. What is your point here, Logical? You need to be more specific. Your idea of "Jehovah" and my idea are probably not the same. And, if we can arrive at some agreement about who Jehovah is, then, who says he condemns homosexuality? Do you believe everything you read is true? What about the idea of mythos and logos when it comes to examining ancient stories? Or, maybe it's as simple as Moses (or whoever wrote those passages) was insecure about his sexual prowess -- and felt it neccessary to adapt a "butch" posture about sexual orientation and projected it onto the people who followed him.
Then you write: "The Greek scriptures too talk about unnatural desires such as homosexuality." If you are using that sentence to challenge homosexuality, then once again, more presumptions, Logical. What if I am not a Christian but a Greek worshiper of Dionysius? And why do I have to interpret those passages the way you do? Is it not logical that these passages are subject to the context of the social environment in which they were written; the personalities of the writers and translators; and the mere act of translating from one language, one culture and era to another. All of this is rife with possibilities for distortion and subjectivity. Or I could deconstruct the passage and argue that homosexuality "celebrates" life.
What I have arrived at, Logical, after much emotional distress and psycic turmoil is that I need to listen to the "truth" of what my heart and experience tells me. By being honest with myself, by being an authentic human being -- then, "the truth shall make [me] free." Now that I believe -- even though I assume we understand differently the majority of the bible.
To be without an authentic self is to be prey to others who will readily supply me with one. The Jewish theologian Abraham Heschel said: "Sin is the refusal of the human to become who we are."
And I love this quote from African-American (and gay) writer James Baldwin: "You have to go the way your blood beats. If you don't live the only life you have, would won't live some other life, you won't live any life at all."
I say, homosexuality is definitely natural and ... logical!
(Non-sexual) Hugs,
rabotnik
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Edited by - rabotnik on 14 March 2001 21:13:43
There is nothing natural about queers.
NOTHING.
Its all in the head. Illness. And it is not natural.
IF IT WAS then Jehovah would have created us asexual, there would be no need for women to bear mens children, as men would be able to do that. But that was not to be the way, as in Adam, God created a perfect partner for him. Not a man or beast, but a WOMAN.
Hello Claudia, Thinker's Wife and larc,
Thanks for your responses. I was thinking that maybe this was the wrong forum to discuss this ....
I've been searching the net and have found some other sites that might be of help to me.
I have many questions concerning the future and my relationship with my family (that I love dearly) and the idea of religion and spirituality. It has all been very difficult and painful.
I feel like I've been living a lie, dishonest with myself and everyone. I now know what is "deep-down true" for myself and to attempt being someone else is to live a lie. Recently I came across this thought by Cervantes: "Donde está la verdad está Dios." (Where truth is, there is God.)I'm going with the truth.
Thanks again.
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2nd letter to log-,
Well, we now know clearly your thinking on the matter!
A minor point, but from your usage you don't know what "asexual" means. And therefore, your reasoning is not logical ... or we could say it is ill-logical.
All the best to you,
The former congregational Queer.
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Question
How natural is sex with children?
