Man, after all, creates gods in his own image.

by Bleep 40 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  expatbrit

  To pick one: Jesus' life, ministry, teachings and miracles are well attested to, yet these events couldn't have been invented by "man", could they?

  Ozzie: Mind me asking why not?

  Expatbrit
• 

  ozziepost

  I don't mind at all, Expat!

  I've found that a good book on this topic is:

  "The Truth about Jesus (The challenge of evidence)" by Paul Barnett.

  It's published by Aquila Press of Sydney (ISBN 1 875861 02 5)

  Cheers, Ozzie
• 

  Bleep

  JanH said, "I appreciate that my message has made you realize the errors of your ways, and that ancient gods like Ba'al, Zevs, Jehovah or Vishnu are all made in the image of man, and that says something very bad about man!"

  Me - You misunderstood the reason I made this post. You think I realized the errors from this?

  This is why I like to help those come to an accurate knowledge in the first place. Those that agree that there has been so many god's that have been worshiped can post here. Satan is behind it all of course.

  Satan is behind it not Jehovah. Jehovah wants all to come to an understanding of him and his way of truth. Satan on the other hand wants people to worship anyone but the true God.

  Haste makes waste JanH.

  Thanks ozzie for some clearity and truth. The Bible points us to the errors of our ways and not man. I and other true Christians have alot of work to do using that Bible.
• 

  Robert_V_Frazier

  This is why I like to help those come to an accurate knowledge in the first place.

  There is no accurate knowledge available from the Watchtower. Or its lackeys.

  Robert Frazier
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  Bleep

  Robert_V_Frazier wrote, "There is no accurate knowledge available from the Watchtower."

  Me - Are you willing to back up that statement of NO accurate knowledge, or are you just trying to be funny?
• 

  funkyderek

  Satan is behind it not Jehovah. Jehovah wants all to come to an understanding of him and his way of truth. Satan on the other hand wants people to worship anyone but the true God.

  Satan seems to be winning by a huge margin. He's managed to fool 99.9% of the people in the world, while your god has only convinced a paltry 0.01% of the truth. I guess Satan is just better at PR than Jehovah.
• 

  Bleep

  Sex does sell doesn't it? Satan has had alot of practice making people turn from Jehovah with one item of sin with fornication.

  The Bible does say to put up the hard fight. And the road is narrow for those who want to obtain the life of everlasting. The other road is wide.
• 

  Scully

  Bleep:

  Let's take a minute and review some of Jehovah's qualities that make him "worthy" of your worship:

  a) for the first 5000 years or so of human existence, Jehovah wanted all males who worshiped him to return their foreskins to him on the eighth day after birth, or upon conversion. (What did Jehovah do with them? Put them on the mantle above his fireplace? Does he have a celestial museum of foreskins? Why does he need them? And if humans don't need them, why create them with foreskins in the first place? Was Jehovah's creation known as man not "good" or "perfect"?)

  b) for the past 2000 years (approx), Jehovah no longer needs foreskins from his followers unless they really really want to give them to him.

  c) during the time of Noah, Jehovah saw fit to destroy the whole world except for eight humans and two (or seven, depending on which chapters of Genesis you choose to believe) of each animal. Apparently things were so bad, that God felt sorry in his heart that he had created mankind.

  d) now, God chooses to turn a blind eye to all the badness going on. Apparently he no longer cares about sky scrapers the way he did at Babel, nor about the fact that there are countless people like Nimrod, "a mighty hunter in opposition to Jehovah" who sacrificed humans for sport, who are mass murderers, rapists, paedophiles and the like.

  e) Jehovah denounced his chosen people the Israelites for following in the steps of the Moabites and other Ba'al worshipers who sacrificed their children to Molech as burnt offerings, saying it "had not come up into my heart" (Jer 7:31; 19:5)

  f) Today, Jehovah's so-called "chosen people" are expected to not only sacrifice their own lives in the name of a seriously flawed blood doctrine, but also the lives of their own children in the name of that doctrine. Not only that, Jehovah's so-called "chosen people" require the testimony of two eye-witnesses to the crime of paedophilia before they can "remove the wicked man from among themselves", but can disfellowship a man and woman who may not have had sexual intercourse, just stayed overnight in the same dwelling without a chaperone.

  This could get to be a long list.... I hope other people will feel free to add to it. But I hope, Bleep, you're beginning to see the kinds of inconsistencies and downright contradictions your "Jehovah" serves up for people who might worship him.

  Love, Scully
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  Bleep

  Scully Wrote, "Not only that, Jehovah's so-called "chosen people" require the testimony of two eye- witnesses to the crime of paedophilia before they can "remove the wicked man from among themselves"

  Since the God of justice want's all to obtain true knowledge why not have two witnesses to balance the scales of justice? Those two would include the one that was mistreated and a teacher that can see that the child is disturbed. Can be anyone else in the household for that matter. Is it right to have more than one person so that the one doing the wrong can be brought to justice? If Jehovah thinks it is then it is ok in my book. One must have a witness just like the court justice system has in the United States of America,I'm not an Elder but I am sure It goes with what I am saying.

  Scully Wrote, "God chooses to turn a blind eye to all the badness going on."

  Maybe yours but not mine. Jehovah knows what is going on and allways did.

  Scully raised alot of questions meaning he is struggling to know the truth about:

  CIRCUMCISION

  The removal of the prepuce, or foreskin, from the male penis. The Hebrew verb mul (circumcise) is used in a literal and a figurative sense. The Greek noun peritome' (circumcision) literally means "a cutting around." (Joh 7:22) "Uncircumcision" is rendered from the Greek term akrobysti'a, which was used in the Greek Septuagint to translate the Hebrew word for "foreskin."-Ro 2:25; Ge 17:11, LXX.

  Jehovah God made circumcision mandatory for Abraham in 1919 B.C.E., a year before Isaac's birth. God said: "This is my covenant that you men will keep . . . Every male of yours must get circumcised." Every male in Abraham's household of both his descendants and dependents was included, and so Abraham, his 13-year-old son Ishmael, and all his slaves took upon themselves this "sign of the covenant." New slaves brought in also had to be circumcised. From then on, any male of the household, slave or free, was to be circumcised the eighth day after birth. Disregard for this divine requirement was punishable by death.-Ge 17:1, 9-14, 23-27.

  Circumcision was practiced in Egypt, as is illustrated in wall paintings and observed in mummies, but it is uncertain when it was first introduced in that country and to what extent it was performed. Some say that Joseph as food administrator introduced it to Egypt. Others cite Herodotus as authority for their claim that Abraham simply borrowed the custom from the Egyptians. Answering these latter claims, W. M. Thomson says: "As to the testimony of Herodotus, who came into Egypt fifteen centuries after, and, with great learning and research, often writes a good deal of nonsense, I refuse utterly to put it in the same category with that of Moses. The great founder of the Jewish commonwealth-the greatest lawgiver on record-born and bred in Egypt, states the facts in relation to the introduction of circumcision among his people. A mere traveller and historian-a foreigner and a Greek-comes along very much later, and makes statements which are partly true, partly erroneous, as Josephus shows in his answer to Apion; and then sceptical authors, more than twenty centuries later than Herodotus, bring up his imperfect statements, and, twisting and expanding them, attempt to prove that Abraham did not receive circumcision from God (as Moses plainly says he did), but from the Egyptians! Not with such weapons can the veracity of Moses be successfully assailed."-The Land and the Book, revised by J. Grande, 1910, p. 593.

  Not only did the Egyptians practice circumcision but the Moabites, the Ammonites, and the Edomites also did. (Jer 9:25, 26) Later, the Samaritans that adhered to the requirements set out in the Pentateuch were also circumcised. On the other hand, the Assyrians, the Babylonians, the Greeks, and notably the Philistines did not practice circumcision. The latter in particular, rather than the Canaanites in general, are derogatorily spoken of as "the uncircumcised," and it was from fighting with them that trophies of foreskins were brought.-Jg 14:3; 15:18; 1Sa 14:6; 17:26; 18:25-27; 2Sa 1:20; 1Ch 10:4.

  Abraham's descendants through Isaac and Jacob faithfully kept the covenant of circumcision. "Abraham proceeded to circumcise Isaac his son when eight days old, just as God had commanded him." (Ge 21:4; Ac 7:8; Ro 4:9-12) The great-grandsons of Abraham told Shechem and his fellow townsmen: "We cannot possibly . . . give our sister [Dinah] to a man who has a foreskin . . . Only on this condition can we give consent to you, that you become like us, by every male of yours getting circumcised." (Ge 34:13-24) Apparently because Moses neglected to circumcise his son, he incurred God's wrath until his wife Zipporah did it for him.-Ex 4:24-26; see ZIPPORAH.

  Circumcision Under the Law. Circumcision was made a mandatory requirement of the Mosaic Law. "On the eighth day [after the birth of a male] the flesh of his foreskin will be circumcised." (Le 12:2, 3) So important was it that, if the eighth day fell on the highly regarded Sabbath, circumcision was to be performed anyway. (Joh 7:22, 23) Examples of parents under this Law who faithfully had their children circumcised on the eighth day include the parents of John the Baptizer, Jesus, and Paul. (Lu 1:59; 2:21; Php 3:4, 5) The Law also required aliens to be circumcised before they were allowed to eat the passover.-Ex 12:43-48.

  Why did the Law specify that circumcision be done on the eighth day?

  Jehovah did not explain, nor was it necessary that he do so. His ways are always right; his reasons, the best. (2Sa 22:31) However, in recent years man has learned some of the physical reasons why the eighth day was a good time to circumcise. Normal amounts of the blood-clotting element called vitamin K are not found in the blood until the fifth to the seventh day after birth. Another clotting factor known as prothrombin is present in amounts only about 30 percent of normal on the third day but on the eighth day is higher than at any other time in the child's life-as much as 110 percent of normal. So, following Jehovah's instructions would help to avoid the danger of hemorrhage. As Dr. S. I. McMillen observes: "From a consideration of vitamin K and prothrombin determinations the perfect day to perform a circumcision is the eighth day . . . [the] day picked by the Creator of vitamin K."-None of These Diseases, 1986, p. 21.

  Circumcision was usually, though not always, performed by the head of the house. In later times an official designated and trained for this operation was used. By the first century it appears to have become the custom to name the boy when he was circumcised.-Lu 1:59, 60; 2:21.

  During the 40-year wilderness wandering, circumcision of the baby boys was not performed. So after crossing the Jordan, Joshua had all those males circumcised with flint knives at Gilgal, and Jehovah protected them until they recuperated.-Jos 5:2-9; see REPROACH.

  After the Exile. Two centuries after the Jews returned from Babylon, Greek influence began to dominate the Middle East, and many peoples abandoned circumcision. But when Syrian King Antiochus IV (Epiphanes) proscribed circumcision, he found Jewish mothers willing to die rather than deny their sons the "sign of the covenant." (Ge 17:11) Years later Roman Emperor Hadrian got the same results when forbidding the Jews to circumcise their boys. Some Jewish athletes, however, who desired to participate in Hellenistic games (in which runners wore no clothing) endeavored to become "uncircumcised" by an operation aimed at restoring some semblance of a foreskin in an effort to avoid scorn and ridicule. Paul may have alluded to such a practice when he counseled Christians: "Was any man called circumcised? Let him not become uncircumcised." (1Co 7:18) The Greek verb here rendered "become uncircumcised" (epispa'omai) literally means "draw upon," evidently referring to drawing the prepuce forward in order to become as if uncircumcised.-Compare Int.

  Not Required of Christians. After Jehovah showed his acceptance of Gentiles into the Christian congregation, and since many from the nations were responding to the preaching of the good news, a decision had to be made by the governing body at Jerusalem on the question, Is it necessary for Gentile Christians to get circumcised in the flesh? The conclusion of the matter: The "necessary things" for Gentiles and Jews alike did not include circumcision.-Ac 15:6-29.

  Paul circumcised Timothy shortly after the decree was issued, not as a matter of faith, but to avoid prejudicing Jews to whom they were going to preach. (Ac 16:1-3; 1Co 9:20) The apostle dealt with the subject in several letters. (Ro 2:25-29; Ga 2:11-14; 5:2-6; 6:12-15; Col 2:11; 3:11) "We are those with the real circumcision [of the heart], who are rendering sacred service by God's spirit," Paul wrote Gentile Christians at Philippi. (Php 3:3) And to those in Corinth he wrote: "Circumcision does not mean a thing, and uncircumcision means not a thing, but observance of God's commandments does."-1Co 7:19.

  So maybe you can understand the reason they did it was to please Jehovah.
• 

  Crazy151drinker

  Bleep wrote:

  Me - Are you willing to back up that statement of NO accurate knowledge, or are you just trying to be funny?

  Well the WT did predict that the world was going to end in 1975, how accurate is that???

  REV:

  I agree with you about God's actions. Yes,sometimes he does things that he would fry us for! But then again, he is GOD and can do whatever he wants!