Get aload of this..

by Xandria 32 Replies latest watchtower scandals

Xandria

Bosho: apparently you don't get what I am saying. An it has become apparent to me that I am going to have to very specific with you. Counseling doesn't mean endangering a child.
IF the Eldership were to take action ( which MANY don't) They would of removed him away from all children in ANY congregation. NOT just the one congregation that he was in, where everyone watched him until he left. ( your words not mine- He left.. do you even know where he went ? DO you know that or IF other children are safe? DO you even CARE .. or just care enough that HE left your CONGREGATION. )
SO that means he can go to another congregation and is a danger to another CHILD. The Eldership is suppost to be shepards of the flock .. well they did not step in enough to protect another child.. even if that meant putting him away as a ward of the state institution. TO GET counseling. COUNSELING doesn't always mean the COUNSEL of the ELDERSHIP. They do not care one way or another .by allowing this person to continue on somewhere else.
I am saying there is a RESPONSIBLITY there that is ignored by many CONGREGATION's HEADSHIP.
I am stating on this issue that THE ELDERSHIP should of took more of a stance to PROTECT the community and other children within other CONGREGATIONS rather than let this person fade into the big picture again AND start all over. The Elders would of also kept in fellowship with him ( I did not say ANYTHING about children.. no child should be around him). Any GODLY infulence ( PASTOR, ELDER, RABBI.. ) could not hurt this person when he is doing such evil.
ANY preditor of a child needs some accountablity. They are MENTALLY ILL and need to be handled in a structured enviroment. Preferably one that they have to keep him heavily under watch.
Now BOSHO.. you need to think before you answer a post. Through all this you have done nothing but attack.
YOU apparently do not comprehend what you read. And READ into things what you want.
You have gone out of your way to start something. An I don't appreciate it. So you are just like every other JW I have encountered.. JUDGING.. not listening and fast to attack.
AN so you know BOSHO.. I am a survivor of ABUSE ! So don't talk at me about a child not being able to protect themselves. I KNOW.
I would appreciate you not coming on my threads to abuse others and attack them for what ever misguided thinking you have. IF U have something good to contribute go right ahead .. but piss off if you are coming to attack.
SpiceItUp

Please bear with me, sometimes what I write bears no resemblance to what I think!

Now THAT truly amused me..thanks for the laugh
I think you're slightly mixed up here. The elders responsibility is to the Children first. In the case of my neice, the man was adamant he had done nothing. How do you counsel that?
He can't be trusted to tell the truth as most criminals arent the most honest in the first place.
Sorry, but you can't have it both ways.
Both ways? Are you kidding----They need to stop treeating the elders like they are equipped to handle such cases. I'm sorry but the average elder that has the education of a GED is NOT qualified to even recommend courses of action for the abused---they need to learn one simple sentence --- "I think you need to report this to the appropiate authorities as this is a criminal offense". What is so difficult.
I asked my mother a question and will pose it to you now as well---- If someone in the congregation witnessed another member murdering someone or stealing something and they went to the elders....should the elders report this matter to the local authorities or shold they "wait on god"?
(((((((((((Xandria)))))))))) you are not alone.
Spice
abbagail

Thanks for that info, Xandria. Did that come off the WT website? I KNOW I read that exact same info somewhere else... I was thinking it was in a BOE letter. I was wondering what was the DATE on that information, if it was from a prior magazine or ???
I DO remember those same points which you highlighted just ticked me off. With their USUAL Subliminal Messaging inserted between the lines, so to speak, they are saying, Forget the perv, and Don't Believe "repressed memories" (which the General JW En Masse, being ignorant on the subject, will assume everyone who is 25 or 30 or 40 and just now talking OUT about being abused, must be suffering from 'repressed memories,' and therefore not to be believed, etc...) In other words, the entire article (above) was a crock.
To TX: I'm glad you brought out that not all repressed memories are planted by therapists. That was my very first thought upon reading this thread. And oddly enough, the WTS BELIEVED IN repressed memories back in their 10/8/91 Awake!, "Healing the Wounds of Child Abuse" pages 3-11, which they no longer list this particular magazine under their Child Abuse Literature. This is why I questioned what is the DATE of the info which Xandria posted at the beginning? (I guess they feel their 10/8/91 Awake! info turned out to be "Bad Light").
On page 7 of that 10/8/91 Awake! magazine, "A Time to Heal," under the subhead, "Repression - Tug-of-War in the Mind," the Awake! says: "Is it not best, then that these things stay buried -- that victims simply forget about them? Some may well choose to do so. Others simply cannot. It is as Job 9:27,28 says, "If I smile and try to forget my pain, all my suffering comes back to haunt me." (Today's English Version). The repression of frightening memories is an exhausting mental effort, a ferocious game of tug-of-war that may even have serious health consequences.
"As a victim gets older, the pressures of life often weaken her ability to repress the past. A whiff of cologne, a familiar-looking face, a startling sound, or even an examination by a doctor or a dentist may trigger a frightening onslaught of memories and feelings. (*footnote: Some memories begin their emergence in the form of psychosomatic pains; others are in the form of hallucinations that may be mistaken for demonic activity -- intruder sounds, such as doors opening; shadowy figures that move by doorways and windows, the feeling of an invisible presence in bed. Such distress generally ceases when the memories fully emerge.) Should she not simply try harder to forget? At this point many victims find relief in trying to remember!" ... etc. etc.
Too much to type out the entire articles. If I remember correctly, this 10/8/91 issue is the one Barbara Anderson begged for them to publish and she helped write it, and they chopped out most of it saying it was tooooooo heavy for the JWs en masse, but overall it is the BEST of their mags on child abuse issues. Too bad they have decided to act like this issue does not even exist. Jerks. Totally Ticks me off!
AND ON TOP OF THAT!!! If the JWs en masse are SO WELL EDUCATED NOW about child abuse, due to the "abundant spiritual food" on the subject of child abuse as the society claims, WHY do the JWs en masse CONTINUE to TREAT the VICTIMS like CRAPOLA and SIDE with the PERVERTS, like they did in Erica's case and the others?
Lastly, abuse survivors sometimes unwittingly use another "survival tactic," i.e., hyperfocusing on an object in the room, during the abuse, in order to "escape." For a true life example of this, get the book, "Little Girl Fly Away." This fully grown middle-aged married woman began to break down, and was "acting out" in all sorts of terrible ways, and her husband had no idea what was happening, and neither did she at the time. It took several years for all the pieces to come out and then fit together. All she remembered was a red bandana, and she didn't know why. To make a long story short, finally she remembered that as a little girl on the farm, the neighbor farmer used to take her in the barn and molest/rape her. And he always tied a red bandana over her mouth (or either he wore a red bandana, I can't remember which... it's been a few years since I read about this). Also, to "escape" from the abuse (in her mind), she would "fly away" like an angel looking down on herself (the actual little girl) in order to escape the abuse. Hence, the title of the book, 'Little Girl Fly Away." --- And I have a similar experience, too long to write out, but without a doubt I believe it can happen this way (i.e., hyperfocusing on an object in the room and, hence, all you remember is THAT OBJECT, but not the actual abuse itself -- at least not yet anyway).
I see we have a "new" JW Apologetic here... (Bosho). It shouldn't take long to jump ship, at least in your mind, if you keep reading. ;) Been there, just like you... up until recently was still defending WTS. There's too much evidence out here to keep oneself blinded for tooo terribly long... This is not to say Jehovah no longer exists or anything like that. Nor is it a denial of the blessings received by him. It is merely an awakening or acknowledging of the obvious blatant (but hidden by them) screw-ups of the WTS itself.
Spice, the Q's you asked your Mom... I saw a thread at Silent Lambs on that very subject, which included a 1962 Watchtower paragraph. Blow me away. If the WTS would LIVE UP TO what it PRINTED in 1962, there would not be the SEX ABUSE SCANDAL of today. I will post it in a new thread called, "Practice What They Preach?"
Also, look for a new thread, "The Garbage Man Cometh..." which is a short 'tongue in cheek' story that evolved as I was replying to another post at Silent Lambs.
Again, if anyone knows the DATE of the info Xandria posted and/or from what magazine or other literature it came from, I'd be interested to know.
THANKS!
GRITS
Edited by - grits on 22 July 2002 7:40:33
Bosho

Xandria,
Firstly, I have to say that I am truly sorry that you suffered as a child. I take it you were one that was failed by the elders and for that too I am sorry.
But I must make it clear that I have not posted here to attack, So now I'm a Apologetic JW, (whatever that is!) to you all.
I actually came here to find answers and some help, I consider myself to be failry open minded and am ready to listen to both sides of everything. But in this thread I have found no answers, only things that have confused me and to be honest upset me a little.
I have never meant to be offensive to any of you but if that is the way you want to READ into my postings then go ahead. Be offended. But it was never meant to be that way.
I expect you think "Good contribution" is where everyone agrees blindly with you. All I can say is whatever happened to supposed "Freedon of speech"?
You can't change the basic truth. Not even MANY elders fail. My families case is not unique.
If one member of a family steals do they all steal? Is it wise to say they all steal?
Some Social workers foul up chronically.... but does that mean the other percent that work damn hard also foul up chronically?
Elders foul up chronically but do they all foul up chronically?
Bosho: apparently you don't get what I am saying. An it has become apparent to me that I am going to have to very specific with you. Counseling doesn't mean endangering a child.
IF the Eldership were to take action ( which MANY don't) They would of removed him away from all children in ANY congregation. NOT just the one congregation that he was in, where everyone watched him until he left. ( your words not mine- He left.. do you even know where he went ? DO you know that or IF other children are safe? DO you even CARE .. or just care enough that HE left your CONGREGATION. )
Read my post again and you'll see what happened!
The other congregation were all informed about him.
I object STRONGLY to you inferring that I do not care about children.
You don't know me at all. I haven't once accused you of anything that warrants that kind of statement from you!
I do care which is one of the reasons I came to this website in the first place!
Now who's being offensive and attacking?
SO that means he can go to another congregation and is a danger to another CHILD. The Eldership is suppost to be shepards of the flock .. well they did not step in enough to protect another child.. even if that meant putting him away as a ward of the state institution. TO GET counseling. COUNSELING doesn't always mean the COUNSEL of the ELDERSHIP. They do not care one way or another .by allowing this person to continue on somewhere else.
How can they "put him away" when he was never found guilty?
How can they possibly stop him? Should they "Take him out" one evening on their way home from the group? Is this what you mean? I don't think you do. But what else could they do? Legally they didn't have a leg to stand on.
I am stating on this issue that THE ELDERSHIP should of took more of a stance to PROTECT the community and other children within other CONGREGATIONS rather than let this person fade into the big picture again AND start all over. The Elders would of also kept in fellowship with him ( I did not say ANYTHING about children.. no child should be around him). Any GODLY infulence ( PASTOR, ELDER, RABBI.. ) could not hurt this person when he is doing such evil.
You talk here as you were witness to this very case. You have no idea what steps were taken.
He's still a menace to society, I expect his name in on a list held in government somewhere. To be dragged out again when he attacks again (which I hope never happens) but it'll be too late then.
NO, my niece was failed by the law courts and not the elders.
He was banned from the congregation (and in my opinion he should have been banned from every congregation, but that's the real issue which everyone here misses).
As for "MENTALLY IL", so? Does that knowledge help me neice? Oh that's okay...he's ill! I think not! He gave up every right he had when he laid hands on the other girl. He may be ill and one day I may find it in my heart to feel sorry for him... not yet though! But if he's ill, then keeping him away from the congregation was a good call.
What else would you have them do?
He had the opportunity of going to other congregation to receive "fellowship" if he choose. His choice.
What would you have them do? Let him back into the congregation so the elders could have "GOLDY fellowship" with him so that not only my niece would see him on a regular basis but also the other little girl involved?
He choose to leave himself, what do you suggest then?
I believe in this case they did what was best. But I am not saying that they always do best.
You seem to think I'm attacking you. I'm not. All I have done is point out that it can be very dangerous to accuse en mass.
You say I've read into things. Up to you of course, but I disagree. Unless of course your words are ambigious.
I still think that you are all missing the big picture here.
The issue isn't whether elders fail or not, a small thing called imperfection will trip anyone up anytime.
I think the real issue (and the one that brought me here in the first place) is the "One Witness Policy" .
I have spoken to several elders and they all find it hard to go along with but (as I'm sure you'll guess, they do go along with it.)
That's why I found your post so upsetting! You're attacking the wrong aspect of this!
Yes, so they cock-up and big time! Who doesn't? Yes, they need to be held accountable and they will be.
But this one Witness business is what gets me and that's what I wanted opinions on.
Every thread on Child abuse seems to miss this (I apologise if I've missed one. I haven't got time to read every thread!)
You all seem to centre on the elders failing which is human imperfection and yes sometimes downright evilness on their parts and yes they should he held accountable! But surly this policy is a far more important issue to address as this means that the elders can't do anything at all (except suggest going to the police, which before you jump up on your high horses is what, despite what you want to think, is what most of them do) if only one witness is brought forward! (How many children are abused in pairs?)
THis is what has me deeply worried.
I just felt that the issue of elders failing had been flogged to death and the real problem was being ignored. I can understand your need to accuse, just accuse the right parties and not everyone.
regards bosho
SpiceItUp,
Both ways? Are you kidding----They need to stop treeating the elders like they are equipped to handle such cases. I'm sorry but the average elder that has the education of a GED is NOT qualified to even recommend courses of action for the abused---they need to learn one simple sentence --- "I think you need to report this to the appropiate authorities as this is a criminal offense". What is so difficult.
I asked my mother a question and will pose it to you now as well---- If someone in the congregation witnessed another member murdering someone or stealing something and they went to the elders....should the elders report this matter to the local authorities or shold they "wait on god"?
Firstly, I'm glad you can laugh at this!
Your right! The Elders are not equipped to deal with this and the policy should be changed. I have never said otherwise.
It takes a trained person to counsel abuse victims. And the elders do say "I think you need to report this to the appropriate authorities as this is a criminal offense" They did to my Brother and his wife. And the two cases close to us recently.
As for the question you asked your mother. It all boils down to this one Witness thing again.
There are so many aspects you would HAVE to look at. Does the person acusing have a grudge against the one acused. (Before you find that amusing, yes it does happen!) If not then yes, I would say report it to the police. Especially if it was murder.
I must be the only witness alive then, that can truly say that if I saw a murder, or someone stealing, or suspected child abuse, I wouldn't even give the elders a second thought. I'd go directly to the police. And then to the elders.
I can see the benefits for two witnesses for alot of things... pretty much eliminates the "I'll get you for that!" situation. BUT it doesn't work with child abuse. And once again, I don't think the fault here lies with the elders but with the source of the policy.
If the society makes a direct turn around on that policy then I'll say "Well done!" if they don't....
that's what this whole thing is about for me.
regards
Bosho
Edited by - bosho on 25 July 2002 11:36:25
saltiest

I don't even want to get into the whole discussing right now but just comment on a line originally quoted:
listen in a kindly way and then apply healing words from the Scriptures
Listen in a kindly way? Yeah, right. All they know how to do is listen so they can pick apart your words by twisting them to suit their needs. Period.
Alicia
Xandria

Yes, you are right the elders do have a responsibilty; Yes they have failed alot of children. Yes they should be held accountable and made to pay for that!

Ok Bosho: I am going to address this first.. again I said " Many " not all Elders. Even your words above, you agree upon the responsiblity of the elders.
If you look at below.. it states in highlighting.. it doesn't relieve us. We the people have a responsiblity too. That is from the earlier post. Again read carefully. That is why the site is here.. to discuss these things and get things out in the open. When people discuss things openly with out reading into things, with out attacking, etc. You get solutions you may of not thought of .. Period.
As for God handling it all in the end.. that is his place to do so. But it doesn't relieve us or the eldership in dealing with the issues. To use and twist many of the teachings to personal benefit, to shun the victim, to harm another person etc. is wrong. An MANY ex-jw's have gone through to much pain and suffering at the hands of the MANY who are out there.
Counseling doesn't mean endangering a child.
COUNSELING doesn't always mean the COUNSEL of the ELDERSHIP. They do not care one way or another by allowing this person to continue on somewhere else. ( Just because he is now what they consider a apostate .. doesn't mean he cannot be "forgiven" and taken back into the "fold". He can be a danger again to another congregation. That is what I meant when do you know where he is.. what he is doing. Because through your anger you may not even care to know. Or for all I know by your words: he left your congregation .. many ( not all) let things end there. An again this person is out there lurking.. and I pray your niece will not come face to face w/ him again. Or if she does she is well armed ( and shoots off an particular apendage).Also couseling in a structured enviroment ( apparently you are not familar with behavior modification) means that they are held accountable for actions. They are watched, even medicated .. and if they are out in society they are registered. This goes beyond what the eldership could do or even wanted to try to do. This person has family does he not ? They could of placed him in a place to recieve the help he apparently needs. He is a sick individual who preys upon children. I don't think he should be out anywhere.. with out being registered or something. An if his family was " JW" they could of been approached by the elders and advised of options (if they cared to do so).
Below another quote where I stated this again.. he should be on a list with all congregations. Even you agreed the Elders have some responsiblity.
I am stating on this issue that THE ELDERSHIP should of took more of a stance to PROTECT the community and other children within other CONGREGATIONS rather than let this person fade into the big picture again AND start all over.
State laws, and statues of limitations need to be looked at in some cases and yes there are some laws that need to be changed. But again I am speaking in a general way.. am not saying all or this case.
Any preditor of a child needs some accountablity. They are Mentally Ill and need to be handled in a structured enviroment. Preferably one that they have to keep him heavily under watch. ( what part of that was hard to understand..? and does someone being mentally ill mean that they are absolved.. no it does not. Mentally Ill does not equate insanity there is a difference and there are many forms of Mental Illness.. this one comes from a perverse mental way of thinking.)
Your way of "pointing" out things is in a accusatory way. You don't listen to what is being written. You have a way of assuming and accusing.
Like you said you don't know me, neither do you know me,and you have a definate way of reading things into people's post that are not there. You are highly on the defensive and because of that, you put yourself as a target for harsh words. Because you put others on the defensive too. Your anger is palatable.. and it comes out as an attack. That is why I have repeatedly ask you to read carefully before you post.
I have nothing against you personally. But, I do have something against you coming in here and attacking in a accusatory way to others and myself. You started of with a topic you knew that was offensive... I don't know you from Adam and you are asking me a personal question about my belief on God. Frankly it is none of your business.
But I am being as open as I can be under the circumstances. You are not allowing any getting to know you phase what- so- ever.
Then also to interject this too because you seem to be stuck on this. An again assuming I stated that this person should be in the Congregation that your niece is in. Again Counsel doesn't mean endangering a child. Elders can go to a person's home it doesn't have to take place at the K.H. :
1.) I did not SAY that the person should be in your Congregation. But the man is in need of some help.. GODLY or otherwise, Because he is a danger to himself and others.
2) Again I said ,Many.. not all. What part of many don't you get ?.. I even posted the webster dictionary meaning on the word.
Again.. he should of been put away ( by the state and /or family member for mental observation and even plainly just put away in a mental instution for illness forever. Men or women who are preditors like this are ill in the way they think. They feel many times a justification for this type of behavior.. and will do it again if not stopped. ( example: Samantha Runnion's Abuser/ and murderer) Once again.. I say SHOULD of .. unfortunately it did not happen.
After this Bosho.. if you don't understand me.. I am not going to go over this again, seriously it is not my cup of tea. To have to argue or defend myself from your accusations and anger. You want to be offensive that is your choice. What does the bible state about a gentle word turning away wrath ?
If you want to get to know me or any one else for that matter, then I suggest you go about it another way. Less defensive. On that note, I will ask that we start fresh and perhaps get to know one another.. then perhaps we can understand eachother better.
An if you want to know about the 2 witness policy ask... there are people on here with Large data bases on a wide variety of subjects. One of them is JanH.. he has alot of good posts and information on teachings and policies. Also Dakota Red, Silent Lamb, Lying Eyes, Wild Turkey, ... just to name a few there are so many on this board.
Just ask if you want to know something on a subject believe me you will get alot of different replies. It is up to you to decide which is the truth for yourself.
Xandria
Bosho

Xandria
If you feel that I have been offensive, then I truly do apologise.
It was never my intention to upset anyone.
Child abuse is a subject that is very emotive at the best of times. Yes, I will admit, that man made me very angry (and it was six years now, as for knowing where he is, he moved away, up country somewhere and I admit I haven't tried to find out where as i'm not even sure how to go about something like that. He cut off all contact with the congregation, and as far as I know hasn't made contact with JW's again. The police may be aware of where he is, I do not know.)
He had no family that I know of and certainly none that are witnesses. This is a question and please I'm not being offensive I just want your opinion on it. How would you go about haveing him institutionalised when according to a court of law he has done no wrong and there is nothing wrong with him? You are right when you say he should be institutionalised. I just don't see how that can happen in this particular case.
I do care about where he is and what he could be doing... I expect it's something that also concerns my brother and his family. But what can we do?
The only comfort they have had is the part you highlighted originaly, "wait on God". That is why I asked if you believed in God. I wasn't trying to attack you or annoy you or anything else... I just wondered if you did believe in God and if you did, how did you feel about the "wait on God" aspect. Did it help you do you think it's viable. That was all I was wondering. I worded it wrong, I should have filled out why I was asking you this, but of course, then everyone jumped off the deepend and it scaled from there.
I really am very sorry if I've upset you or anyone else here.
I have gone back over my own posts and I while I stand by what I was trying to say I realise that I haven't said it very well and have come across offensively. I apologise.
Xandria

I can understand how emotional this issue can be and sadly many don't look at options when emotions are running high. We all make mistakes and just so we learn and go on that is fine. It is not my intention to offend either... it is to exchange ideals and perhaps find a better way of handling these issues.
If the elders .. spoke to the family, they may have suggested he go for "observation" where a psychologist evaluates him( someone outside of the Org so it is impartial).. they can keep him for several days to the max of 4 weeks. In that time, if they had found him with abnormal psychological issues or thoughts, then they could have pushed a longer stay and/or instutionalized him if it was really bad.
It would of been documented that this person had these tendencies and the courts from there can make a manditory ruling for treatment or jail if he refuses. They could of presented it in a way as to solve a problem. At least it is something even if it was documented that he "visited". Which can later be evidence.
Courts do not make decisions on psychological matters unless it can be proven this person is mentally ill and is a danger to himself or others. Laws are changing slowly.. and I think there should be a law that mandates that a person who is accused ( even falsely) have to go through evaluation. That way there is a paper trail.. and if it happens that the courts fail at least this person will be documented on his illness, and then the victim can push for action if the preditor does it again. Also it gives the victim and prior victim legal recourse for damages if it is proven later. I am sure there are thearapy bills that this perpetrator caused.
Under victim rights ( which is not always what it should be).. you can do a search to see if there is any documentation or cases pertaining to him under the freedom of information act. You can check past cases and if he has any recent .. you have to know which county it happened in.
Victim rights .. are what is also something else that should be worked upon. So that the victim can be notified that the person is out of jail. An if the accused has repeated the abuse with another victim.
I know that waiting on Jehovah is a comfort. But also taking an active role in changing things such as lobbying for laws and writing your congress representative pushing for stronger and better laws is how change happens. At least you know deep down in side you did everything humanly possible with the courts. But what about those who .. are still dealing with the issue of bringing thier abuser to justice or deal with the issues. It is important for us as a community to come together and help eachother out. Look at who they caught when they did.. they caught Samantha Runnion's murderer. If they did that all the time... watching out for eachother.. perhaps they can prevent it from happening.
Where the laws protect him/her and revictimize the victim ? I have see alot. My husband has a back ground too in working with Abused Children. He worked in a girls group home ( days for sometime and then worked part time production work. ) what he saw of the system ( made him ill at times) but there were small victories. He worked in Child Care and Advocacy until 1991. Me I stopped working for the District in 1998. Had enough of seeing the abuses and fighting only to see it continue on. I now write and try to get things changed, knowledge is the key and power to change.
Until laws change ( or we force change by asking our people in office to do their jobs) then these misrepresentations and failures in justice will happen. The same with the Elders, those who do not enforce justice ( in a correct way and not in kangaroo courts). The two witness "biblical law" is not going to help.
Xandria
Xandria

PS: Police also have the right.. to send someone for Observation for 3 days .. if he is showing to be mentally unstable. A danger to him and others, or will inflict harm to himself,etc.
X
Bosho

I have a feeling that American law is slightly different to English law.
In this country if a person goes to court they can not use past convictions or any records to convict him.
There was a case recently of a little girl called Sarah Paine who was abducted and killed. Her murderer was caught and went to court, but it wasn't until after the trial was over that the Jury and indeed the general public was allowed to find out that he had offended repeatedly before. My bug bear with this is that if a person offends once he should never be allowed to walk about in public again. But as it stands, they serve their time if they are convicted, and then allowed to be set free and reoffend, even with "supposed help".
As it stands the system just doesn't work, people like yourself and your husband do a remarkably wonderful job, and it must be heart breaking.
The problem needs to be attacked at the root, but how can that happen? Is there any behaviour in children that might point to them one day being "Abusers", is there any way it can be spotted earlier and dealt with before it can do harm?
I know a lot of people think that history repeats itself and that if a person has been abused they are more likely to abuse.... but I disagree with this, it may happen sometimes, but surly not enough to make the rule. My husband, while not being sexually abused as a child was beaten with belts, spoons and anything else that came to hand, but he has certainly not repeated history with out child.
There was a case here about ten or so years ago with a little boy called Jamie Bulger. He was abducted from a shopping center by two boys no more than twelve. They killed him and left him on some railway lines. They were sent to a children's prison.
At the time, several videos were said to have caused the children to do this. Also I believe both children had bad homelives. But the problem comes in whether these children have changed, should they be released, maybe they will never re-offend, maybe they will. Without a crystal ball it's something that can't be discovered until it might be too late. There seems to be no answers to these problems (Except God, hopefully).
I don't know if you would agree with this, but I certainly feel that a lot of what children are exposed to does have an adverse affect on them. My friends little girls were watching "Tom and Jerry" cartoons (She's nearly five and her sister is nearly four) my friend suddenly became aware that the older girl was banging the younger one on the head with a saucepan she had taken from the cupboard (part of their drum kit usualy!) she stopped her and asked her why she was doing it and the girl replied "I'm Tom and she's Jerry". My friend hasn't let them watch cartoons since. I know we can't completely shield our children from everything, but maybe what they see does have a bearing on how they act later on in life.
I don't know about the Samantha Runnion case, was this in the states?
Communities working together is definitly a start to protecting our children. In this country we have a thing called "neighbourhood watch", which while originaly worked to protect against burglary, now extends (in our estate anyway) to keeping an eye on our children. (A child just has to cry and curtains are twitching) We are working to get a community room that the children can use to socialise together so they don't play on the streets, which is a real danger, not only for getting knocked over but for being snatched from the streets. Everyone has to be prepared to step in and help though. We can't rely on the authorities for protection all the time. In this country we have a real problem with not enough police, under paid police with too much on their hands already.
I have to admit that I can see no real long term answer, except the solution that God will step in and sort things out. But in the mean time there does have to be a change structurally to our laws.
In your P.S. you say that the police have the right to send someone for Observation, does this apply in England too? I was very interested to read that as I was not aware they could do this. It would certainly help.

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