2000 years after the dead carpenter failed to return as promised christians are still predicting his parousia "any day now".
This is only possible because faith somehow came to be viewed as a virtue.
Is Faith Immoral?
by Coded Logic 82 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Dis-Member
Terry
If you are alone on an island, there are no moral acts beyond maintaining life itself.
To NOT TRY to maintain life (build a fire, make a "HELP" sign out of rocks, search for food, go fishing, attempt to purify sea water, etc.) is immoral.
To give up HOPE is to condemn yourself to non-existence.
FAITH is a form of HOPE.
Hope says, "I will maintain a positive outlook and effort even though I acknowledge the possibility of failure."
Faith says, "I am absolutely convinced things will turn out for the best no matter what comes."
Faith is irrational, but has the side-effect of giving you a fighting chance.Terry sir I don't know how you do it but you have wonderful ability to crystallize some of the most difficult to realise concepts into bite sized digestible chunks. This is a beautiful gift. I really enjoy your solid and clear thinking as it helps me to understand how I am evolving with TTATT.
You really should write a book sir!
I don't even think about faith now. I have no reason to have any. But I do have great hope, and that is what keeps my flame inside alight and burning. -
abbasgreta
Cofty: Naughty! You were a church-goer - you will recall that the 'any day now' approach to Jesus' return was never even mentioned, let alone taught.
Christians have the Spirit of Christ dwelling in them. If He returned tomorrow - wonderful, if I die first - still wonderful. Nothing is able to separate me from Him.
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PSacramento
When people willfully believe something without evidence, or contrary to evidence, are they neglecting thier moral responsibility? So many people say faith is a virtue but I just can't comprehend why anyone would think that.
That kind of faith CAN be immoral, if used for immoral goals.
"Blind faith" is probably the worse kind to be honest, it is a faith based on ignorance, a faith based on not WANTING to believe a much as HAVING to believe and ignoring anything that may call that faith into question. It is the weakest of all faiths IMO.
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cofty
Any remnant of faith that the dead carpenter is coming back at any time is blind faith. It is not based on a shred of evidence and ignores 2000 years of evidence to the contrary.
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abbasgreta
Cofty: What's really behind your calling Jesus 'the dead carpenter' ?
The bible informs us that Jesus whilst on earth was indeed a carpenter.
But you don't believe what the bible says.
So you might as well refer to Him as "Lord" which is His current and correct bible status ( the Name above all names - Phill 2:6-11)
Easier to type.
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cofty
If he existed he was a carpenter who developed delusions of grandeur and became an itinerant preacher.
He enticed gullible men to abandon their wives, children and businesses and follow him around Palestine preaching a false prophecy about his imminent parousia.
He is unworthy of the title lord.
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Terry
You really should write a book sir!
Heck, thanks--I DID--I did.
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sunny23
Where does that gut feeling of right and wrong come from?
When someone who is raised in a family without God or religion then picks up the bible and reads things out of Leviticus or Deuteronomy (ie honor killings and the like) and then also reads about the Golden Rule in there as well, they are judging with their pre-established brain and sense of right and wrong as to whether to follow these "pearls of wisdom" or not. God is not needed for morals.
The gut feeling of right and wrong comes from our instinctual emotional response to minimize suffering, maximize happiness, and keep propogation foremost. Thanks to natural selection anyway. Notice that animals typically don't kill other animals of the same species but when they do (feuding ant colonies, lions eating cubs who joined a new pride, etc) it is usually justified as defense, territory claims, or some other necessary reason. Outside of that animals dont usually "murder" without cause. They must have learned it from the bible. If it's ingrained by God then God must have failed to ingrain it to an adequate degree in many mass murdering humans. Or as I like to believe, its murderers who lack something biologically to drive them to murder rather than not having been ingrained with enough empathy by God.
I like Terry's analogy on the island and using faith as a tool for survival and positivity and thats great. In some religions, faith can be used as a tool for positivity for many. However I don't see it being a necessary tool for survival. It has however been used as a tool for killing others. Yet the faith iself isn't to be judged as immoral, the action is to be judged as immoral. To label faith alone as immoral is like saying, "computer desk is immoral."
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abbasgreta
Cofty: 'Preached a false prophecy of his imminent return' Rubbish. Proof texting will throw that out within 5 mins.
'If he existed'. Many unchallenged secular contemporary reports confirm it.
Just because the families of the apostles' circumstances aren't especially mentioned is NO proof they were abandoned.
You know this 'proof' tactic is 'below the belt'.
Might as well conclude Jesus never cut his nails for 33 and a half years - his personal grooming habits aren't mentioned either.
Well, to conclude, he is definitely MY Lord - as the worship song goes...
"One day every tongue will confess You are God,
One day every knee will bow,
Still the greatest treasure remains
for those who gladly choose You now..." Phil 2 : 6-11
I only wish you peace and contentment Cofty, through whatever or whoever you have placed your trust.
