I answered the FDS loyalty question to the elders / Here is their response

by Daniel1555 26 Replies latest members private

  • Daniel1555
    Daniel1555

    Over the last years I had a lot of discussions with the elders about several things I believe differently. The most crucial things were the "shunning" and "blood doctrine."

    Last december I told the elders that I would accept blood in a medical urgency for myself and my little son and I wrote them all my reasons for it, even biblical reasons (I had to tell them, because otherwise my wife would have told them). Here is the link to that thread:

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/medical/267774/1/I-told-the-elders-that-I-would-take-blood-and-donate-blood#.U8biffl_t1Y

    In April the elders told me directly that they need an answer to the following questions. By the way I answer these questions they would decide if I can continue to be a Jehovah's witness (inside I am already longtime no JW).

    Do you accept and believe that the faithful and discreet slave is the governing body and is directed by Jehovah? Do you accept the teachings that the faithful and discreet slave set up? Here the where I asked for some ideas how to answer those questions:

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/members/private/277285/1/Now-finally-the-elders-want-a-clear-answer-They-know-my-stand-about-blood-and-much-more#.U8biw_l_t1Y

    Now I would like to tell you how I answered those "loyalty questions" and how the elders decided.

    I answered like that:

    I respect the governing body as humans who lead an organisation, who without doubt gives its best, to live according to the bible and to serve Jehovah. Matth 18:20 says that if 2 or 3 are gathered in Jesus name, he is in their midst. In this sense I also believe that Jesus can be with the governing body if they are honestly gathered in his name. However I don't believe that Jehovah and Jesus are leading "all" their decisions and teachings now and in the past. But I can't give you a definite answer concerning this, because I am just a small human being and can't read the toughts of god. I do not believe a teaching automatically, because it comes from the organisation. I believe in a teaching, if it is based firmly on the bible, not going over what is written and if it is in harmony with Jesus love. I dedicated myself to my heavenly father, the creator of all, and not to a human institution. Therefore my loyalty belongs to him, not a human organisation. I see myself therefore as a servant of god and I try to live my daily life in a way that is pleasing to him.

    So what do you think, how would the elders respond to that statement?

    I sent it by e-mail to them. I decided for myself, that I will never ever talk to them again about my personal faith. I will not give them anymore authority over my life.

    A few days later I received a reply from the Cobe saying. "Thanks for your mail."

    Then I didn't hear anything for nearly 1 and 1/2 months. Just last week I received a phone call. 2 elders were calling. They told me, that I obviously don't accept the gb's teachings. There I just blocked off, because I was not in a position to talk freely.

    So I called one elder a few days later, asking him to repeat it. First he told me, that normally they need to be 2 elders for that, but nevertheless he will tell me their decision.

    He explained to me, that I obviously don't accept some main JW teachings like the blood doctrine. I agreed that this is the case and that I don't agree at all with the society's view on blood (this point is very important for me). He told me that as I don't agree with fundamental JW teachings, I would be prone to apostasy. So the elders decided that I am not allowed to talk to any other brother or family member about these things (he doesn't know, that my family and close friends know about my views). If I did that, they would form a judicial committee. Finally he said he hopes I will come to the meetings and if I need to, I can discuss these issues only with the elders.

    Actually this outcome is not that bad. The elders won't harass me with more discussions about it. From the phone call I have the feeling that they will leave me with it.

    Since december I am not going in field service (no report) and since February I am missing most of the meetings. Next week is the first time that I don't attend the convention.

    To see the truth about the truth and to be free inside from this indoctrination makes me feel happy.

  • EndofMysteries
    EndofMysteries

    I had somewhat a similar situation. Depending on how you go about it, if you have a good argument, and aren't actively going against the organization according to what they know (telling others what you think), it's possible to just have an inactive status. Friends and family then on their own may choose if they want to associate or not with you, at that point it's a conscious decision on them according to the elders vs if you are dfed then they could get dfed if they associate, etc.

  • whathappened
    whathappened

    Sounds like a win, win situation! Good, you are on the road to complete freedom.

  • DesirousOfChange
    DesirousOfChange

    I'd bet a buck that the reason for the delay of more than a month was because they called the Service Department and were instructed to write it all out and mail it to the Service Department. They just recently got their reply and contacted you. The fact that they didn't jump on your refusal to accept the Holy GB's doctrine on Blood Transfusions just makes me think that some of the speculation that a change is coming on that issue could really be on the mark.

    Doc

  • steve2
    steve2

    Good on you for providing clearly written and calm-toned responses to their questions. Even so, will the end result still be that you will be (eventually) treated as a disfellowshipped or disassociated person?

  • Hortensia
    Hortensia

    He told me that as I don't agree with fundamental JW teachings, I would be prone to apostasy. So the elders decided that I am not allowed to talk to any other brother or family member about these things

    Why can't they see that this is crazy? Censorship is one of the things all cults do, and all tyrannical governments, too. So as long as you keep quiet about your thoughts and pretend to go along with the party line, they'll leave you alone. If you dare to speak the truth, well, the witch hunt begins.

  • problemaddict
    problemaddict

    While completely and utterly angering......the brillian thing is that they basically said "you don't bother us and keep your name out of our ears, and we will leave you alone."

    This is great, because now you can get on with it. These guys aren't going to bug you anymore.

    I HATE....statements like "prone to apostacy", or "obviously you feel ___", or even "you can only discuss this with the elders". Yeah.....that discussion went really well....you guys had nothing to say.

    Your statement to them was perfectly reasonable, and didn't require that response. They just want to control you.

    The questions that would come out of my smart alec mouth would have been...

    Can you define a "main teaching" if JW's and what is not a "main teaching" please?

    What does "prone to apostacy" mean? How do you define one as being "prone" to a sin any more than any other person who is a sinner? That makes no sense.

    Do you agree with everything that has always been printed 100%? So you think Jesus intended for lockstep uniformity or emphasized conscience when it came to certain things?

    Can you please give me the specific details regarding your threat of a judicial comitee please in writing? I assume you mean a conversation in which I am attempting to convince someone else of the validity of my viewpoint, not simply coming to know I feel differently. Surely people that know me, and have seen me fade from the congregation will have an idea that i feel differently.

    I also must ask you brothers to not discuss me or my views with anyone on or off of the body. No personal opinion should be given regarding my "status" or being "weak" tot he congregation, or I will consider it slander and will inform the CO. Can you brothers assure me you will not be discussing me with anyone, without my presence?

    Anyways.......thats just me. :)

  • Daniel1555
    Daniel1555

    Sometimes I was wondering if it is better to be officially disassociated. Especially as I would like my little boy (who is living with his overly zealous jw mum) one day to see the truth about this organisation (I will not speak negatively about it, I will just strengthen his free thinking skills).

    I said to myself that I can always disassociate if it should be necessary one day. But now in my situation it would complicate my life too much, if I am da /df.

    In the last months I was able to start some new wonderful friendships with kind and caring people who are no jw.

  • Daniel1555
    Daniel1555

    An organisation who forbids someone to just mention another viewpoint. Such an organisation is FULL OF FEAR.

    If their teachings are the truth, they wouldn't be afraid of another viewpoint or critical voices.

  • joe134cd
    joe134cd

    I'm surprised they didn't kick you the hell out!!!

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