A View From Outside (page 3)

nugget

If a religion demands certain sacrifices from it's followers even to the point that they die for the cause then it has to be worthy of that sacrifice. If it is unwilling to be challenged and tested then it has no right to demand alliegence or respect.

mouthy

Yes I did call him a "COCK" in London England where I grew up that was a loving term like
Mate,love,sweetie,precious,It was a common occurrence to hear it shouted out to a passer by

WATCHA COCK!!!

Sorry if I offended anyone. Us cockneys do on occassion

DJS

mrhomme,

Your post doesn't deserve a response, but I couldn't resist. And please stop cutting me some slack. I reached my current atheist position a LONG time ago after decades of very intense analysis and study. It had nothing to do with anger towards your make believe god or the JWs. I would suggest that most if not all the non-theists arrived at similar conclusions in similar manners. Your post is the most arrogant (and ridiculous) thing I have read on this board to date. All we do is rely on facts; we criticize, deservedly so, ridiculous premises, defnitive statements where no facts are provided and other such drivel by theists or non-theists alked. The non-theists are the only ones on this forum who actually talk about rational data and facts.

So please. Stop your patronizing and don't cut me any slack. If you wish to discuss any topic in a rational, debating manner. Bring it.

mouthy

DJS!!!Now be nice. Surely Atheists can show LOVE!!!! cant they.?
I know many who do show love not arguing if I dont agree with you.
I am one of those who you think is demented...
.I believe in the WAY! TRUTH!LIFE> JESUS

mrhhome

Why do I view atheism as a religion?

(1) We are debating the existence of something that is beyond our ability to perceive, or if you believe the mystics, at least on the very edge of our ability to perceive. Consequently, any statement about its existence or not is speculation, and any belief in that existence or not is a matter of faith.

(2) In my experience, most secular dogma is based on as many unchallenged tenents as any religion which professes belief in the supernatural.

(3) In modern Western society, atheist are more evangelical about their belief system than any Baptist or JW.

Apognophos

Well, there goes this thread. Now no one will stay on-topic.

Joe Grundy

My duty to respond, I think.

First - re 'cock'. Mouthy (Grace) has explained this. It is an expression I use myself, as in 'All right, cock?'. There are no doubt some hidden semantics somewhere (maybe the old cockney 'cock sparrer') but it's along the lines that I can call Grace 'duck'. No problems, no issues.

Second - my comments re 'dowdy' JW women were ill-chosen and I had no wish to cause offence. I am sure that there are JW 'hot chicks' (I haven't seen any) but what I wanted to convey was that the JWs I see doing FS are uniformly 'beige'. By that I mean that they share a look. Uninterested in what they are doing (elsewhere called the 'pioneer shuffle') and really not interested in talking about what they really believe - because IME they don't know what they really believe.

Third - no, I am not an 'evangelical' atheist, and I think very carefully before I say anything. I would hate to do anything which might contribute to the loss of faith of someone whose life, sanity, etc., depends on it. But if someone 'evangelises' to me, I respond.

I was a cop for 30 years, most as a detective, and for a significant part of that running a Fraud Squad. Con men (and women) were my stock in trade. The way to deal with them was (and remains, IME) to ask simple questions - who, why, when, how, etc. - and NOT be deflected by spurious crap. This approach works pretty well and can be applied (for example) when looking at Russell, Rutherford and others (as far as the JW history is concerned). Cut away the crap, look at the historical context, and challenge, challenge.

Apropos of nothing, I once arrested a local politician who had 'misclaimed' - stolen, in common parlance - £60k in fraudulent expenses. His explanations and justifications were a wonder to behold. But (though he hated them) the basic questions were simple. His answers were pure unadulterated crap. He went to prison. I think of him sometimes when I read of the GB floundering on child protection issues, etc. They are not much different.

I'm sorry if my OP was harsh. I have much sympathy for JWs, and I can't really know just how bad it is to live under their restrictions, the fear of shunning, etc. But I will, if I get the chance, oppose their 'ministry' just as I will that of any religion.

LoisLane looking for Superman

Of Joe, You are a dear SweetHeart.

I have no idea what granny Mouthy called you, because I have the setting on my computer, that anything that might be a naughty word gets this treatment ******** then I have to figure out what that word was. lol

I understand what you are trying to say Joe, and I appreciate it.

We need outside the box thinkers like you and Jgnat, that have never been Zombiefied JW's.

Thank you for bringing your career skills here to the table to help us.

LoisLane

Miss.Fit

Welcome. I can tell you will be an interesting addition. I hope you'll stay awhile. Your wife is lucky to have you to watch her back.

Missy

A View From Outside

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