Did You Claim Your Slavery Tax Credits?

by expatbrit 47 Replies latest jw friends

  • teenyuck

    The bottom line on paying anything to anyone for past injustices....is that we all pay!!!

    Who pays taxes? You and I. What company, hit with a hugh "reparations debt" is not going to raise prices? Who pays the higher prices? You and I. For every dollar they pay out, they will raise the price of something $1.50 to make up for it. The government coffer is not full....have you heard of the national debt? Who is going to refill it? You and I.

    The Japanese and the Holocaust survivors are still alive. They are being paid because they are still alive.

    Paying out money that comes from the pockets of consumers and tax payers hurts everyone. No one wins.

    How do you separate all the black who came here recently (last 150 years) from the slaves? There is no way. What about someone from Haiti who says his great-grandfather was a slave? Where? Here or in Haiti? Should we pay every black person?

    This is a no win situation.

    I feel bad for the things that happened to black people over the last century...however, why should I pay for "injustice?" If that is the case, then every person who feels wronged by someone else will file a claim. The Irish, the Italians, the list goes on and on.

    If the country decides to pay reparations, every country in the world will be paying reparations....for all the slavery that has happened over the last 7000 years of recorded history. Why stop at the US? Go after all the African nations that still sell people into slavery.

    A tax rebate is an advance on what your projected tax refund will be next year. It is not a "rebate", it is an advance. The government hoped to boost the economy by giving people their refund early. Most people put it in the bank or paid off Visa.

    That has nothing to do with reparations for events that occured 150 years ago.

    Find the records, go after the slave owners and their families...I am fine with that. Since my family came here and cleaned toilets from about 1910, I see no reason why I should be penalized with higher taxes. Go after Aetna and all the other companies that profited. I won't use their products since the prices will be higher. Than you will run them out of business and everyone can feel better.

    Perhaps all the Chinese decendants should go after the rail companies for them building the railroads. We (you and I) can fund that. So the reparation you feel entitled to can then be turned over the a Chninese family.

  • borgfree
    The only factor causing any separation for irish people was their inherited catholicism, not SKIN color. Irish people are WHITE, and anglo-saxon like their northern european conterparts. No matter how much you would like us to believe that poor innocent irish immigrants were of a different color, they were NOT. White is white.

    I have heard, for a very long time, the argument that the persecution of black people was because of the color of their skin. I seriously doubt that argument is valid. Most white people would love to have dark skin and they spend vast amounts of time and money to darken their skin.

    Whatever negative feelings I may have toward the black race is not skin color. I went through school with a large percentage of black students. I personally did not see any worse treatment directed at black kids by white kids than I saw from black kids directed at white kids.

    I was once very supportive of black people and defended them at times. But,when the black "leaders" started demanding special rights and money, when quotas requiring so many blacks in EVERY movie, tv show, every employment area, etc, etc. started, even though many black people may not have been a part of those demands, they were still happy to benefit from them, when black people refuse to be a part of this country in their behavior, speech, etc., but instead would like to destroy everything "white", I changed a lot of my attitudes.


    "We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home." Edward R. Murrow
  • AGuest

    Well, dear, PuffsRule... peace to you... and all I can say is:

    If your dear loved ones happens to get involved in a blowout in a Ford vehicle caused by a defective Firestone tire... and dies as a result... and YOU experience loss, pain and suffering as a result... please... PLEASE... do not bring suit. Why? Because, well:

    1. Your loved one is dead.

    2. Both Ford and Firestone will raise their prices to compensate for their loss in paying YOU, which will results in costs to ME. And Lord knows I could give a D*MN about YOUR loss, just don't charge ME for it!

    See, according to YOU, this is undesirable and so a lawsuit should not be allowed to be brought.

    Now, I know where you will go: all slaves did not die as a result of slavery and/or its negligence. Perhaps. But I would venture to say that a great many DID:

    On ships crossing the Atlantic

    On the shores of Africa when they would not just lie down and concede to being kidnapped

    When they tried to escape

    When they failed to obey or move fast enough

    When they were pregnant or old or ill and refused nourishment, heat
    and/or medical care

    From broken hearts when their husbands, wives, daughters, sons, mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, etc., were ripped from their lives because they could bring a profit...

    And perhaps not even the receive the bliss of death but had to endure maiming and separation...

    I could go on and on and on.

    Sure, black folks TODAY need to get over it and get on with their lives... in the same way that eventually YOU would need to get over the loss of YOUR loved at the hands of Ford and Firestone... who SCRIMPED... to your loved ones detriment and LIFE... in order to make a profit.

    BUT... you would STILL seek damages. I promise you, you would. Even though you know that NO amount of money could ever compensate for your loss. The 'crime' to YOU would be, though, not imposing SOME penalty upon Ford and Firestone for the NEGLIGENCE!

    Now, you wouldn't sue the employees of Firestone as they didn't 'do' it, but only what they were told by the 'bosses' to do. And you wouldn't sue the bosses of Firestone because they didn't 'do' it, either, the employees did. Who would you sue? THE CORPORATION! Who pays? Its SHAREHOLDERS! How do they recoup their costs? RAISE PRICES!

    (All of a sudden folks forget what kind of country... corporate capitalistic... this is! Heck, even the "non-profit" U.S. Postal service is crying cause they can't make a profit!)

    If, Firestone raised its prices, what, then, should I do? Keep buying Firestone tires?! Call me a fool, but...

    If the Government raises taxes to make you and me pay for reparations... and you and I pay them... then you and I have NO one to blame but ourselves. For they cannot do it... unless you and I allow them to. And if you and I allow them to... well...

    I exhort you to take a class in Government, dear Plum, and come out of the dark ages and backwoods thinking of the "Revenoo-ers". We VOTE for raised taxes in this country, yes? Yes. Or don't vote against them. Otherwise, this country is not the 'democracy' so many of you THINK it to be and can do pretty much what it wants.

    (Well, well... consider THAT, if you will...)

    Funny, I wonder if this had occurred with YOUR ancestors, whether you would have problems deciding on what is 'just'...)

    Again, earthling man... go figure.

    A slave of Christ,


  • elbobbo

    Hey aguest, if the US is such a horrible place for blacks then why are you still here? Tell ya what, pack your things now and I will personally buy you a one way ticket back to Africa where your life will be oh so much better because you won't have to live in fear of white people. Sure, there's a very good chance that another black person will kill you or you'll have poorer sanitation and medication to treat illnesses but since you seem so concerned about the atrocities faced by black people here I will personally buy your ticket over there just so I don't have to put up with your whining anymore because if you go back to your homeland I can almost garantee that you won't be able to have communications like you do here.
    Or, and this is just some crazy idea, accept that while it is horrible that black people sold each other to slave traders, your life is actually much better now than it would be if that never happened just the same way life is better for the many Irish, Chinese, whatever nationality, people who's ancestors came here and sacrificed much to make a better life for themselves and their families.

  • larc


    A couple of questions,

    1. Ancestors on my dad's side of the family, both through my grandmother and grandfather came to this country from Ireland in the 1700's. None of then had slaves. I know because I checked the tax records. Should I be exempt from a reparations tax?

    2. My great grandfather on my mother's side was assinated in 1910 in Pitt County, North Carolina because he hired black people to work on his farm. His untimely death put a great financial burden on my grandfather, his oldest son. Should I get money from the government for the actions of my great grandfather?

    3. A distant ancestor of my grandmother on my father's side of the family, threatened two bounty hunters who were after a run away slave who was on my ancestor's farm. This bold stance by a fiesty, large framed Scotch-Irishmen prevented the run away slave from being captured. Should I get some money for this?

    4. Should the Egyptians pay the Jews for their time in slavery?

    5. How is share cropping on someone else's land any different than coal mining, living in a company house, using company money to buy at the company store? This is what the Robber Barons did to the whites in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan and all through Appelachian Mountains.

  • D8TA
    While you became incensed and launched personal attacks in your arguments, I did not.

    Oh really? Though not SPECIFICALLY directed at me, how do you want me to take....

    How dare YOU minimize the black holocaust? How dare YOU take for granted the many peaceful nights your ancestors (and YOU) have enjoyed sleeping without fear of white robes or masks?
    And WHO exactly is the "YOU" is in reference here? ANYONE and EVERYONE on this board who is not in line with your point of view. Pray tell, how is ONE or MANY not to take this judgemental statement personally?

    Take accountability for blanket statements buddy. Those are YOUR words, not mine.

    As far as education is concerned, I have more than the average and have taught at the University level.
    And I will say it again .... go to a "real" college. Though I'm two years from reaching my Ph.D. in Cultural Anthropology....gee, I can also claim that "I too, have taught at the University level" as a professor's assistant, or in layman terms a "teacher's aid".

    I can only ask you if you have ever completed any course work in african-american studies or race?
    YES I have! I am also very aware of my lineage! And I will be happy to point out that NO WHERE in my previous statement I implied that people of African decent did not suffer these atrocities. I DID point out that I do not take a narrow stance such as yourself, simply that OTHER ethnic people have suffered similar if not the same persecutions you have mentioned. This is called: being OBJECTIVE.

    Your argument clearly is showing that African descendant's atrocities greatly outweigh other atrocities upon various ethnic groups in the U.S.

    To clearly give credence to ONE ethnic group's atrocity over VARIOUS other ethnic group's atrocity does not JUSTIFY your position.

    I'm going to retract something. You are NOT IGNORANT. You do show that you do hold the knowledge of various other ethnic atrocities...you just are INSENSITIVE to them. You feel that the African descendant atrocity DESERVES SUPERIOR and SPEACIAL treatment.

    I challenge any of you scholarly, intelligent, elite, to produce documented evidence of violent campaigns carried out by the KKK against german, POLISH, irish, scottish, or british immigrants.

    Now, produce evidence of lynchings, church burnings, home burnings, rape, murder, segregation, that proves european immigrants suffered in the same manner as post-civil war blacks, and I will retract my original statements and issue to one an all a public apology.

    Do I really NEED to provide evidence of Polish or East(Slavic) and South European(Italian/Greek/etc) persecution at the hands of the KKK? Or at the treatment of other "racist" citizens of the time, or modern era? How about the Jewish people? Arabic? Asian?

    Also, what brought the irish here to america was exploitation and abuse by the british, not issues of skin color as the irish and the british are the SAME color....

    So, while immigrants were exploited for the menial jobs, (mostly because of class and education NOT COLOR),

    Whether it's hard for you to accept or not, COLOR OF SKIN is NOT THE ENTIRE ISSUE. The African descendants and slaves you speak of, their "skin color" is indeed a darker pigment. That's is an obivious observation. Were and are they TRULY discriminated because of "darker" skin? OR is this discrimination based on the ideology of the people who discriminate, that this ethnic group is a "lower form" of a human. Or did/do they acknowledge their humanity at all? Are you saying that people who discriminate, discriminate ENTIRELY on the COLOR of one's skin? Yes, a lot do, yet it's not the whole reason.

    But then, how do YOU explain discrimination the "lighter" pigment ethnic groups? Is a "light" skinned Jew, discriminated because their "COLOR"? Or a Eastern European of "light pigment" discriminated because of their "color"?

    You also raised the "class" issue, sorry but...discrimination based on one's class is no lesser then disrimination on one's ethnicity, and or color. Discrimination is discrimination.

    Or is, as I stated, these people are discriminated due to people who view these ethinic groups as being "lesser"?

    Grandstanding and attemtping to share in the persecution of blacks in order to appease consciences is an old strategy to minimize history and reduce responsibility.
    WHOM'S responsibility? MINE? YOURS? THEIRS? Who here has ANY responsibility to slavery issue, now? WHO? Are you stating that I have responsibility? Or: Rhett? Puffsrule? Expabrit? JT? SixofNine? Bakeduck? Megadude? Sunscapes? Hyghlandr? Waiting? AGuest?

    Since my Granparents on my Mother side came in the 1950's from Hungry from a long line of poor farmers. And my Father is 50% Native American with 50% African descendant ancestory. What possible "responsibility" do I share in paying an repriations? For simply being a citizen in the U.S.? Is that your argument? So tell me, how are we to go about this?

    Your entire argument is that a "select" ethnic group is ENTITLED to repreations due to the treatment caused by a "select" group of people. Yet, EVERYONE must hold responsibility. That doesn't fly.

    Tell me, what of the ancestors of people who fought, died, and persecuted in their effort to "free" your select group? Are they entitled to pay these repriations? Or are they ALSO entitled to repreations?

    Is this "equal" justice?

    I've said this before:

    Try THINKING out your response before stepping on peoples toes.
    Did you "think" that the statements that you've made would NOT be taken personally by some people here? Did you "think" that you stating that EVERYONE, who is not of this "select" group you champion for, would NOT take it personally when you insist that WE/THEY ARE responsibile for the atrocity of slavery in the past?

    As a decendant (from my father's side) of "slaves", did you "think" that you would not step on my toes when making blanket statements? That EVERYONE is responsible?


  • Hyghlandyr

    Ok I have been working most of the evening, and slept most of the morning, so I only had time to respond to the hyghlandyr is a total loser thread.

    Now I have a moment to make a couple preambles to my real comments here which will follow after I bathe.

    First, it is interesting that Utopian wants pictures of Irishmen being lynched, and infers, states outright, that such things did not happen? Ok, I will hunt some up for you. I will also prepare a reading list for you.

    The issue with the Irish btw was not because they were Catholics. Most americans think that it is a Protestant vs Catholic war then and now. It is not. The real issue relates to something you said also, so I will address them both, your claim and the Issue.

    You stated

    Irish people are WHITE, and anglo-saxon like their northern european conterparts. No matter how much you would like us to believe that poor innocent irish immigrants were of a different color, they were NOT. White is white.
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. I almost fell over laughing when I read that. Sorry Irish people are not anglo saxon. The anglos, saxons and jutes came from the continent in the first millenium, near the end, and continued in successive waves throughout the past millenium. First into britain, alba, and eventually to Eire. They are Germanic peoples.

    Irish belong to what we call the Celtic family of peoples. Specifically the Gaelic. This is based upon language and customs. Prior to the Roman invasions there were hundreds of Gallic races existing in europe. Each had a distinct identity, but shared common bonds of language, religion, and culture. When the romans invaded, gallic identity began to be consildated as various tribes joined forces either against the romans or for them. Eventually they thought of themselves as one people, one race, as opposed to say the race of the greeks or romans. And before you give me some whiney comment about there being only four races, go look up the word in a dictionary and see in which manner I am using it here.

    The Tuetons, germans, and others had a distinctly different culture, language, and religious concept. Especially language is where we trace these things, because language, more than anything, is what gives us our world view, and our identity. Germanic languages are different from celtic languages.

    The troubles in Ireland are not based on religion. They are based on race, language, and culture. The Anglos, saxons and jutes, among others, are a recent addition to the islands. The vikings as well.

    Particularly in Eire, when invaders came, conquered and settled, they assimilated. They began speaking Gaeilge, the vikings with a scandanavian accent, their descendants still speaking it like that to this day. They took our marraige customs, our religion, our world view, our bravado. This also occured with the anglos. Those that came over and conquered us, were assimilated by us, became us. When Henry VIII came to speak with his nobles in Eire, he had to speak through an interpreter because most of them could not speak english. Thus a saying arose 'more irish than the irish.' The leaders in england were very disturbed at this and forbid intermarraige. Eventually the new anglos that were sent over, and the scots, did not assimilate. Thus you had two distinct groups, native (often catholic) Irish, and invading Anglos (Anglican) and Scots (Presbyterians).

    And never the twain would meet, as they say. Yes there was some interbreeding, but very little. Most of the anglos settled in the six Ulster Counties in the North. I wont get into the modern troubles and their development at the moment, that can be saved for another post. However I think these comments suffice to demonstrate that the Gaels are not Anglo-Saxons. At any rate my claims are easy to verify.

    Now as skin color, are the Irish white. Yes, and no. Which Irish are you talking about? The ones that mingled with the anglos, the 'more Irish than Irish' Irish? Or are you talking about the Tuatha? Or perhaps the Milesians, what we call 'black Irish.' All of the other Irish usually have very pale skin, generally dark hair, red being most often seen in those of royal descent. Blonds also being fairly common. (Though many Irish can trace their lineage to royalty since a man or a woman might be king over merely 20 or so, and in a few months be replaced by his fella. It was actually a very democratic sort of society) But the Milesians on the other hand, are greeks. Some think that perhaps they are spaniards. They have dark skin, and usually dark hair. Much debate has raged as to just where they came from and when. But it is obvious they are not 'white'.

    But also, let us ask that question again. Are the Irish white? Yes, and no. Depends on whether you are talking skin color or race. None of the races of europe of the past couple of centuries considered the Irish their race. They certainly did not consider them white. They were mongloids, descened from apes when Darwin was popularized, while other europeans were descended from adam and eve. Pure humans were they. We, were sub humans. We had smaller brains, were lazy, were unable to display good morals, were dirty, stunk to high heaven even when we bathed, we were unintelligent and needed the assistance of the europeans to care for us, because we were unable to care for ourselves. Why if you dont believe it, just look at the wretched state of Ireland, they would say smugly. Of course they ignored the fact that Ireland, like africa, was in such a state because of centuries of unending occupation, violence, and rape.

    Thankfully we have white skin so we can hide and pretend to be proper europeans.

    As far as the Irish being innocent? The things I point out in no way claim that. Who was there before we were? Who did we take the land from? We enslaved british and then whined when the anglos enslaved us. (British are celtic peoples, as are welsh, and cornish.) When the civil war broke out and the Irish were drafted, while wealthy anglos were able to dodge, new york city broke out in riots, and who did they kill? Anglos? Of course not. Oppressed peoples never attack the oppressors, merely other oppressed. Several black men were killed. By Irish. However, it was the Irish police force that put down the riots and stopped further killing. It was a result of those police that the term 'New Yorks finest' was coined.

    Andrew Carnegie? ok...I will also name names, Jessie Jackson. Did the Irish see his swindling then? Some did and some spoke out. How many blacks see how Jackson is swindling them? Each race attacks itself, and others. That is just the long run of history. And I am not pretending in any sense that the Irish are innocent. However, they have been viciously persecuted all over the world and in America. As have the jews, and germans and italians and the native americans, and on.

    You and I do agree on one point for different reasons. Give the blacks slave reparations. The african countries that sold your ancestors to us, owe us reparations for selling us the poor quality goods. All that are left here owe the indians land reparations. You owe me war reparations, since my ancestors died, freeing your ancestors. And the United States owes me marraige reparations for enforcing an unnatural state of monogamy by sentence, law and gun.

    And finally, then I am off to poop and bathe, this has been touched on often by the critics of slave reparations, but the proponents always seem to gloss over it. They state, as you did, that reparations are not about money. Ok...even so you want money? Ok. Now be specific. What form would reparations take. Who would pay. Who would receive. Would it be individuals? Blacks? Are blacks that came here after slavery ended going to get reparations also? What about blacks that moved here in 1956? Would it include white descendants of black slaves? White descendants of white slaves? And so on. You know the questions. What exactly are we looking for. Also, how long would the reparations go on? To all now? for three generations? three hundred years?

    This question is open to Aguest also, not just Utopian.

  • plmkrzy

    I'll probably get bashed as a bigo't for this but the thing that really bugs me is TO This Day if i turn on DefComedyJam I KNOW I am going to hear the same format I heard when it was ANight AtAppollo.
    Same jokes. Same format and all of it racial. It gets really old after a while. I'll onlt turn it on maybe once every 6 months now and then I usually only watch it for about 2 or 3 min.

    As For the money?
    Iv'e read most the posts and IMO everyone has valid reasons for there stand. The only thing I would like to add would be my objections to how much we let our government get away with when it comes to how money is spent. As long as our President can sit on a toilet and flush with a soild gold handle I cannot object to the decendants of slaves being compensated.
    There is not enough balance in this country and especially since we are such a world power we should be more then able to afford compensation where it is due without taxes being raised and that would be possible if all americans could figure out a way to make all the politicians that are playing with the money play fair.

    plumCrazy, of the posts too much because she has way too much time on her hands class.


  • Utopian Reformist
    Utopian Reformist


    I knew you would return to "split the hairs" and dissect the entire irish lineage for us all. Thank you. I was trying to be brief. I was well aware of my ancient roman history, the viking conquests, the celtic tribes and everything in between.

    However, whether or not you split hairs and pick and choose your personal favorite time periods in ancient irish/celtic/gaelic history, the fact is even your so-called "black irish" were and are nothing more than WHITE people with dark brown or black hair. The irish of today, yesterday and tommorow have always been and always will be WHITE.

    Having brunette features does not make black or brown skin, which the climate of your ancestors could not support. It wasn't necessary for me to dissect the EXACT names of all of the ancestral groups and tribes forming modern day irish geneology. My main point is irish people are WHITE like most europeans, and therefore did not suffer the SAME level and degree of hate and prejudice and violence as african-americans, hispanics, native american indians.

    During your research, you may find evidence of exploitation of irish labor, signs indicating "NO DOGS AND NO IRISH" allowed in places like turn-of-the-century Boston, however, you will NOT find mobs of americans lynching irish immigrants, or hangings, or burining irish homes.

    By the time italians starting arriving, most of the police and fire departments had already been subjugated and controlled by the irish, a legacy surviving to this day. What legacy is there for post-civil war african americans? Is there anything like a piper's band and shamrocks to lead a procession or holiday parade of proud african americans in some particular field, job or service?

    Were the irish ever forced to sleep in separate quarters while risking their lives in military service during wartime? Did other whites dress themselves and paint themselves like the irish to entertain crowds like the vaudeville entertainers of the 1920's and 1930's? You know the answer.

    Now, getting back to the main point of this entire discussion...Should americans contribute to a reparations fund out of their tax dollars?

    The questions is linked to your degree of sensitivity and humanity. We have all seen hundreds of reports of government "pork" projects, government waste, and general government corruption over the years. It has provided material for many "60 Minutes" "DateLine" "20/20" episodes over the years. Once we learned of the waste, what did we do about it?

    For the most part, we shrugged our shoulders in disgust and went back to our daily lives. I use this premise to illustrate a point about equality. We can tolerate waste, scandals and corruption, because we would rather pour moeny down the drain (or into WHITE pockets of corrupt officials) rather than allow the government to make partial reparations. That statement will sting, but its true.

    I say create a revolving fund. Begin the fund by assessing fines or penalties to the industries that profitted the most from slavery (textiles, tobacco, etc..). The objection will be the "company no longer engages in these practices" however, how did the company grow to such modern-day stature? It's time to pay back and share the rewards.

    The fund should only be used to provide business loans, tuition, and home financing. It shoudl not be used to provide a daily living or food and shelter. Public assistance has already taken care of that for years. Applicants would need documentation of their ancestry to qualify.

    Now, back to Highlander. I am sure you are very proud of your gaelic roots. I say "ERIN GO BRAGH" and believe me, despite my natural inclinations, I have found admirable qualities and human spirit amongst the irish. I will never forget that the "irish never quit". I stil feel today that the British have done enough harm in Eire and simply need to let go and leave. There is much to be proud in your history. Find it, enjoy it and make examples for yourself.

    During this discussion, my goal was to point the differences in the degrees and levels of prejudice and persecution suffered by african americans and immigrants. If you followed any of the links I posted yesterday, you will read some interesting statistics compiled by many researchers and scholars on the subject.

    Now, if you would like to discuss the plight of the immigrants as a whole and draw comparisons from within the spectre of european ethnic groups, that would be interesting and a much more "even" level playing field. For example, the large german speaking communities in Wisconsin, which 50 years later became the location of american prison camps for german prisoners of war.

    However, the final conclusion is immigration and slavery are an apples and oranges comparison. One is deserving of reparation, and the other is questionable.

  • teenyuck

    Since there are people's everywhere who have been oppressed and enslaved, I believe this topic now neeeds to go to the UN.

    The UN can untangle the who enslaved who and who owes who reparations.

    Looking at the UK, I think they have a claim against the Norwegians. Since William the Conqueror invaded, numerous people lost lives, homes and were enslaved by the Norsemen. I see reparations. And the UK became the greatest country on earth...built upon the backs of the citizens who were enslaved!

    I think the Aussie Aboriginals have a claim against the current people inhabiting the island, as well as the UK. The UK did send over all those criminals since the prisons were full and all.

    I also think the former criminals families have a claim against the UK for sending them thousands of miles away to an unfriendly country where they labored long and hard to build rails etc.

    Don't even get me started on the middle east!

    Are you starting to see a pattern?

    Oh, and AGuest, I had a Ford Explorer with the exploding wheels. You know what I did? I gave it back and got an Acura. Much safer.

    Your logic on using this is as clear as it is on the "tax rebate." Go to the IRS.gov website and read up on the "rebate" you received. You want to make sure you deducted that amount from the refund you are owed for 2001. Oh, and BTW, today is filing day....get that report in by 11:59 pm or you will pay a penalty.

    Oh, one other thing...if my ancestor died because a Model A Ford overturned because the tires were bad.....TOOO BAAAADDD!!!!! However, I keep forgetting my ancestors could not speak English or read or drive or own a car....they walked and took buses, when those were invented.

    It would have happened way to long ago for me to file suit....have you heard of the statute of limitations? That is put in place so people who have been "harmed" by someone else can sue for in civil court for damages-with a limit of XX number of years. Usually it is 2 years. Hmmmm, I am thinking 145 years is a little long, even for the US.

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