Arguments in favor of the destruction of Jerusalem in 607 BCE

by TJ Curioso 87 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • TJ Curioso
    TJ Curioso

    I received the following explanation in favor of the date of 607 BCE. Accepted comments on the points at issue.

    Conclusion

    Here are the failed prophecies if 587 BCE is the correct date for Jerusalem's destruction.

    Jerusalem uninhabited and in ruins for 70 years.

    If 587 BCE is correct, then the desolation ends in 517 BCE. By this time homes had been built and crops grown for over 20 years (Haggai 1:4, 11). Alternatively, if the desolation ends in 537 BCE, the period is only 50 years, not 70. Alternatively, if the period began in 3rd year of Jehoiakim, the desolation is only 68 years, not 70, and whole passages of Jeremiah are wrong. No matter what argument is used, the prophecy fails.

    70 years of the nations servitude to Babylon, starting with Nebuchadnezzar

    If 70 years begin in Jehoiakim's 3rd year of rulership, servitude lasts 68 years, not 70. If servitude begins in 609 BCE (secular chronology) with the defeat of Assyria, Nebuchadnezzar is not King for another 2 years, but prophecies state nations serve him and not his father; once King, servitude lasts 68 years, not 70.

    Tyre forgotten for 70 years.

    Period begins after the destruction of Jerusalem (Ezekiel 26:1), which is 587 BCE at the earliest. Period ends when Tyre's profit becomes holy to Jehovah (Isaiah 23:14), in 537 BCE (Ezra 3:1). Only 50 years have passed, not 70.

    Egypt devastated for 40 years.

    Ezekiel gave prophecy in 570 BCE (Ezekiel 29:17) and devastation begins in 568 BCE. Within 30 years Egypt has a King and holds a foreign alliance, and all exiles were released from Babylon, also Kingdom strong enough to rebuff Persian Empire. The 40-year period ends uneventfully in 528 BCE.

    However, the 607 BCE date fits all the chronologies and prophecies like a glove! It creates no contradictions, no failed prophecies, and requires no complex arguments or contrived explanations. All one needs to do is accept what the Bible plainly says, that 70 years is 70 years long.

    607 BCE – the only date that works

    Here is the result when we accept the Bible's mathematics — that 70 years is 70 years long:

    Jerusalem uninhabited and in ruins for 70 years.

    If 607 BCE is correct, then the desolation ends right on time in 537 BCE when the Jews are back in their cities.

    70 years of the nations servitude to Nebuchadnezzar

    If 70 years begin in 607 BCE, servitude lasts the full 70 years. Nebuchadnezzar is King at start as prophecies stated.

    Tyre forgotten for 70 years.

    Period begins after the destruction of Jerusalem (Ezekiel 26:1), which is 607 BCE. Period ends precisely 70 years later when Tyre's profit becomes holy to Jehovah (Isaiah 23:14), in 537 BCE (Ezra 3:1) when Tyre provides materials for the new temple.

    Egypt devastated for 40 years.

    Ezekiel gave prophecy in 590 BCE (Ezekiel 29:17) and devastation begins in 588 BCE, ends exactly 40 years later in 548 BCE. A year later secular chronology records Egypt's King holding a foreign alliance.

    The date 607 BCE is the only date which fits — and not only does it fit, but it fitsextremely well. If one is “searching for truth”, as many 587-promoters claim to be doing, shouldn't one only abandon 607 BCE if there is a better explanation? Is 587 a better explanation? Does it harmonize with the Bible in a better way than 607? Most certainly not! —See our summary chart

    The only reasonable conclusion is that 607 BCE is the date of Jerusalem's destruction. One would have to be extremely biased, rabidly opposed to Jehovah's Witnesses, or just have no regard for the Bible's inspiration to promote any other date. According to God's Word the Bible, the desolation began with the city of Jerusalem, and it began in 607 BCE. —See our time-line for an overview of the whole chronology

    Month-to-month

    In fact, the 607 BCE date even allows the 70-year desolation to begin and end in the exact same month. The Watchtower of 15th January 2006 explains:

    In the seventh month of 537 B.C.E. (Tishri, corresponding to September/October), the faithful returnees offered their first sacrifice. King Nebuchadnezzar had entered Jerusalem in the fifth month (Ab, corresponding to July/August) of 607 B.C.E., and two months later [in the seventh month] the city's desolation was complete (2 Kings 25:8-17, 22-26) As foretold, Jerusalem's 70-year desolation ended right on time. (Jeremiah 25:11, 29:10) Anything Jehovah's Word foretells always comes true.

    Click to enlarge

    On the other hand, not a single one of the 587-based theories creates such a perfect harmonization. In fact, all chronologies based on 587 cause massive contradictions, causes four prophecies to fail, and makes entire passages of Jeremiah just plain wrong.

    What the passages “actually” mean

    Worst of all, scriptural accounts which are perfectly clear and understandable, apparently require an expert to tell you what they actually mean.

    When the Bible says Jerusalem and Judah are both devastated for 70 years, it doesn't actually mean 70. When it says 40 years for Egypt, it doesn't actually mean 40. When Jeremiah said the land will be devastated, he actually meant it already was. When the Bible said the land would be without an inhabitant, it didn't actually mean without any inhabitants. When the Bible says all the princes were in Jerusalem, it didn't actuallymean all the princes were there. When the Bible said Daniel was trained for 3 years before seeing the King, it didn't actually mean 3 years before seeing the King. When it said Tyre would be forgotten for 70 years until helping rebuild the temple, it didn't actuallymean 70. And so on and so forth.

    We are strongly reminded of the tactics of Trinitarians, how they try to explain away clear words and tell you how “the father is greater than I am” actuallydoesn't mean that. The Bible simply doesn't agree with 587 BCE, and attempts to make it fit are contrived, complicated, and end up contradicting whole sets of scriptures. They use secular dates sourced from unknown pagan astrologers to over-ride the inspired writings of faithful Bible prophets, causing it's prophecies to fail; they go further and play with the word of God – inventing an exile that never occurred, just to suit their own ideas. It truly is a disgrace.

    On the other hand, we as Jehovah's Witnesses are determined to go with thewhole Bible record and what it says rather than unproven writings of historians — who may or may not have an ax to grind and reasons to slant history to suit their own beliefs.

    Your Decision

    Will you accept the chronology of the Bible and it's inspired prophecies – God's view – or, will you believe the secular chronology and the viewpoint of imperfect human historians and their Bible-contradicting dates?

    This essay and website has been researched, written, and created by brothers who, at one time, believed that 607 BCE was incorrect, and that 587 BCE was more likely. We read the claims of apostates, and were gullible enough to be taken in by them. After some time we realized that the promoters of 587 were not motivated by “truth seeking”, as they so often claim, but rather from an arrogant desire to simply prove the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York wrong, and to prove themselves more clever or more righteous than Jehovah's people, whom they hold in obvious contempt.

    After much research we can now see that the year 607 BCE really is correct according to the Bible. As the apostle once warned, we were “so quickly removed from the One who called [us] with Christ’s undeserved kindness, over to another sort of good news. But it is not another; only there are certain ones who are causing you trouble and wanting to pervert the good news about the Christ.” (Galatians 1:6-7) Now we see clearly that Jehovah's Witnesses are right, and 587 is wrong.

    There is a very popular book which advocates the 587 BCE date, written by an apostate with a disturbing cult-like following. To successfully draw people out of the truth, he promotes 587 to discredit the 1914 doctrine. He conveniently forgets to mention that 587 contradicts the Bible so much that it makes entire prophecies fail, of course.

    By putting on a false piety, pretending to be merely seeking truth, he has fooled many into believing the secular chronology. By using twisted methods of interpretations he even convinces many that the Bible supports this ridiculousness too!

    One woman who read his book (and left the truth being erroneously convinced 607 is wrong) remarked that she had “found the truth about the truth”. She then quoted Jesus in saying “the truth shall set you free!”, happy that she doesn't have to go to meetings anymore or preach as Christ commanded, as she is now more enlightened than the ignorant Jehovah's Witnesses.

    However, she and thousands like her are totally and utterly fooled. Talking of a divisive issue back in the 1st century, the apostle comments, “Once you were making fine progress, who got at you so that you now are no longer convinced of the truth? That persuasion did not come from the one who called you, and now the whole lump is in a ferment because of that small amount of yeast. Yet I am confident that all of you who belong to Christ will not deviate from your convictions; but the one who is upsetting you, whoever that is, he is the one who will bear the responsibility.” Galatians 5:7-10, 2001 New Testament

    Also the apostle advises how we should treat ones who cause such problems,“keep your eye on those who cause divisions and occasions for stumbling contrary to the teaching that you have learned, and avoid them. For men of that sort are slaves, not of our Lord Christ, but of their own bellies; and by smooth talk and complimentary speech they seduce the hearts of guileless ones.” (Romans 17:18-19) Yes, for “...their word will spread like gangrene.” 2 Timothy 2:17

  • Sapphy
    Sapphy

    "In fact, all chronologies based on 587 cause massive contradictions, causes four prophecies to fail, and makes entire passages of Jeremiah just plain wrong ."

    That's only a problem is you start from the premise "The Bible can't be wrong".

    Remember, the society is only invested in the 607 date for as long as they cling to 1914 having any prophetic meaning. When they get some new light and chuck the 1914 concept, the 607/587 debate becomes moot.

    NB - remember, Egypt was never devestated. Ezekiel got it wrong.

  • sosoconfused
    sosoconfused

    Using Bible prophecy as the basis for thousands of pieces of Evidence being wrong is not the way to go

  • TJ Curioso
    TJ Curioso

    I don't believe in 607 AEC. I only want arguments to contradict this information that I received.

  • AnnOMaly
    AnnOMaly

    You 'received'? Somebody sent you this? This is only a c&p from http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/607/conclusion.html

    You'll find the rebuttals laid out on Jeffro's site: http://jeffro77.wordpress.com/response-to-607-website/#ChapterC

  • mindnumbed
    mindnumbed

    TJ, you might try this post, it seems to address at least some of the arguments

    http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/bible/112819/1/607-70-years-1914

  • sosoconfused
    sosoconfused

    The problem is that even if you had proof to the contrary which is tons of archaeological evidence - it won't matter to someone who thinks that the bible is 100% correct. There is no middle ground. If you had a stone tablet unearthed from Babylon that said "Although you think this happened in 607 it didn't! It happened last year in 587 so your bible is wrong" They still would not believe you... The best thing to do is just leave them alone and tell them that WTBTS said that dressing your Cat up like a human is tantamount to idolatry and false worship. Pray to god they are an animal lover and maybe their own emotions will appeal to them

  • DATA-DOG
    DATA-DOG

    This stuff gives me a headache. I envy you guys who take this subject on. I know that this is a different subject, but notice what this JW claims:

    ".. scriptural accounts which are perfectly clear and understandable, apparently require an expert to tell you what they actually mean."

    Perhaps you could ask them what the scriptures say about 1 Timothy 2:5, as opposed to what their " experts " say the scriptures actually mean? This could open the door to their minds and hearts. They may never get anywhere with 607/587 if they can't grasp 1 Tim 2:5.

    WT 1967 10/1

    " . Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an organization, not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the Bible. For this reason the Bible cannot be properly understood without Jehovah's visible organization in mind."

  • Londo111
    Londo111

    There are many interpretations of the 70 years. Some are more viable than others. Even if there is a fault in the arguments of the 70 years in regard 587/586 BC, that in itself does not prove 607 BC. However, even sticking with the Bible alone, a good case for 587/586 BC is more grounded than 607 BC.

    Ezra 6:15 shows the temple being finished in 516 BC. Subtract 70 years. Therefore, one interpretation of the 70 years is that it goes from 586 BC to 516 BC.

    In 520 BC, Haggai addresses people who saw the Temple “in its glory”. If Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC these people would be in their 90’s. If Jerusalem was destroyed in 587/586 BC, these people would be in their 70’s. Which is more likely?

    Haggai’s prophetic partner Zechariah (reading chapters 1 and 7) shows that Judah and Jerusalem had been devastated 70 years at that point. If we back up from the time of Zechariah, we come to around the time the final siege of Jerusalem. 587/587 BC makes more sense here, than 607 BC.

    However, this is not the only interpretation. I’m not so sure Zechariah’s 70 years are Jeremiah’s 70 years.

    If we take a plain reading of Jeremiah 25, the 70 years were a time when the nations would serve Babylon and would end when Babylon was punished (this happens in 539 BC). There was a 70 year period from the fall of Assyria to the fall of Babylon (609 to 539 BC).

    Alternatively, the battle of Carchemish in 605 BC was when Judah along with Syria, Asia Minor, northern Arabia and so forth was brought under Babylonian control and remained in Babylonian hands until 539 BC. This was a period of 66 years. I don’t see what is objectionable about the 70 years being a rounded figure, an approximated period of time.

    Jeremiah 52:28-30 shows there were three waves of exiles…the third occurring in Nebuchadnezzar’s 23 rd year. Jerusalem is destroyed in his 18 th year. So if the 18 th year was 607 BC and the land was totally inhabited for 70 years from that date—who got deported in the 23 rd year of Nebuchadnezzar?

    There is much to dismantle in the 607 argument in the opening post and it has in other threads and websites. Much of it is an ad hominem attack. One of the accusations is that those who argue for 587/586 BC claim one needs to rely on an ‘expert’ interpreter.

    However, it’s far from the case. It is not rocket science. The issues, when broken down in their component parts, can be grasped by everyone. It is the obfuscation of Watchtower theology that makes this more complicated than it needs to be.

  • AnnOMaly
    AnnOMaly

    I’m not so sure Zechariah’s 70 years are Jeremiah’s 70 years.

    They are not. Jeremiah's 70 years relate to the period of Babylonian domination over the nations. Zechariah's 70 years relate to the period of mourning over the temple's ruined state up to Darius I's time. The question was whether there should still be fasting in the fifth month (temple destroyed) and the seventh month (Gedaliah's assassination).

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