by DarkFireWolf 40 Replies latest jw friends
You could ask why were scribes given the job of writing down many insignificant dealings in human history , which has nothing to do with our time , when the sayings of jesus was too much to record..? The bible says something like if all jesus sayings were written down it would be too much to handle . ? excuse me ? When was the last time you went to a library , even the most basic library ., contains millions of words that jesus never uttered ,and he was supposed to set us free..
smiddy
"..... the Watchtower uses Jehovah because of its supposed familiarity ... since when is the Organization more concerned with what is popular over what is correct?" <-- I think they will just respond that Jehovah is consistent in latin countries as it's the latinised form of Yahweh just like Jesus is the latinised form of Yeshua and that in the western world we use the other latinised Biblical names. I would only bring this one up if you personally have a problem with that and feel it's a "deal breaker" as far as your faith is concerned. There are other threads that look into the question of whether Jehovah/Yahweh is actually God's name which might provide some stronger secular questionings on the use of Jehovah. Also JWFacts has some good topics on a number of subjects that might inspire some questions for you.
If the elders sense that you are not genuine in your concerns, or that you are just trying to find holes in WT logic or trying to promote contary teachings they are not going to listen to you. If they get the feeling that you have been viewing anything 'apostate' they are not going to try and answer any questions you raise, they will just want to know your motives for questioning and what has brought these feelings up.
Then you can expect a question along the lines of, 'Do you believe Jehovah is directing this organization?'
This is all that matters to them when you start questioning the fundemental doctrines.
If they feel you are genuine in your concerns expect some WT article refrences, a few on the subjects you raise and some on not reading anything apostate or critical of Jehovahs organization. You will be told to pray and wait on Jehovah. Another sheparding visit will probably be arranged a bit later to see how you are going.
The only chance of getting them to think about what they believe is to try and act as genuine and humble as you can. They have to feel that you don't have any answers. If they think you are trying get them to reach a conclusion they will just stay in WT drone mode.
If you can play humble student your questions might stay with them for a while and have some effect on there faith. But if they think you are trying to play teacher you won't get anywhere.
I think there are many thought provoking questions you can raise but it is more the way you ask and conduct yourself that will determine the how effective they are.
Why is the wearing of wedding rings is a "conscience descision" but celebrating birthdays is forbidden?
Why is one pagan thing okay but another is wrong?
I would keep it simple, I would ask
What is the difference between Hananiah the prophet and the WTS
both taught things, and caused people to believe in a date when an event
would happen
Would New light have saved Hananiah ? If he Humbly adjusted himself ?
Is there anything in the Bible that would save someone like Hananiah
from death ?
Trust , they will compare the WTS to Nathan the prophet
that's where you will have to remind them that Nathan never said
Jehovah told him the things he told david, or that he was guide by the holy spirit
as a matter of , an angel was sent to correct Nathan that very night
.
Ask them to hold vipers like NT says they should be able to because they are protected by God. If they refuse or die from a bite then god obviously doesnt approve of them.
I woudn't even bother wasting your time.
Take it from me, I was an elder.
There is a fear of impossible questions and don't many elders don't want to be cornered.....it damages their self image and ego......not to mention the WBT$ authority. You'll get marked. They might even give your parents a hard time too.
You are wasting your time. Just leave when the time is right but beware....for now if you live at home and start making waves then your parents might ask you to leave!
for what i gathered he doesn't live at home and just wants to tell his parents that the elders couldn't give satisfying answers to his questions either. so it's more of an alibi situation.
Forget talking with the elders. Just talk to your parents. Don't try to be cute, clever or "win" arguments, just be real.
Consider this exchange in an interview with Bertrand Russell on religion:
Q: Do you think there's a practical reason for having a religious belief ?
A: Well there can't be a practical reason for believing what isn't true! … Either a thing is true or it isn't. If it is true you should believe it, and if it isn't you shouldn't. And if you can't find out whether it's true or whether isn't you should suspend judgment.
It seems to me a fundamental dishonesty and a fundamental treachery to intellectual integrity to hold a belief because you think it's useful and not because you think it's true.
- - - - - - - - -
This quote is also good:
If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell
Depends what you want to achieve, if you do not want to be DA'd or DF'd then be careful who you ask certain questions.
When I received a shepherding visit about 9 months after ceasing going DtoD, and of course not reporting any time, I said I could not go and teach a doctrine not in the Bible i.e the 1914 rubbish. The Elder who called on me to get me back knocking said he would return and prove the 1914 doctrine to me, that was several years ago, he has not come back.
Later on, a few months after, I asked two different Elders to defend the teaching about the 1919 choosing by Jesus to me.
Neither of them have got back to me. I have managed to make myself a Do Not Call by that method, good little Dubbies are warned to stay well clear of me and my 'poztate thinking.
All I did was ask for answers/explanations of their fundamental doctrines upon which the religion stands, and bases its claims to being God's organization and to being directed by Holy Spirit, and three long serving Elders were unable to do that.
