Greeting, dear TT, and peace to you! I would like to respond, if I may? Thank you! If you don't mind, I am going to reverse the order of your questions, because the order of their occurrence is reversed:
who are the ones that come out of the tribulation. what is the proof that they are not physical persons that were actually IN the tribulation.
if the WT is wrong about physical people living on earth during the thousand years, then who are "those nations in the four corners of the earth, god and magog" & "the number of these is as the sand of the sea. And they advanced..."?
These are actually both, dear one: persons in physical bodies when they come out of the tribulation... then changed to spirit bodies shortly after. They are those of the non-Israelite nations who "washed their robes in the blood of the Lamb"... and, along with 144,000 from among the sons of Israel... are taken to be kings and priests in the kingdom and temple of God. Here's what occurs:
There is a great tribulation which has never occurred before nor will occur again. While it had some fulfilllment between 60-70 C.E. (what happened to the Jews as a result of their rebellion while under Roman rule), that tribulation was actually surpassed by what occurred in the early 20th century - the Jewish Holocaust. While both of these events were horrors... neither are the one that "will never occur again." That is yet in the future. What you're interest in, however, occurs "immediately AFTER the tribulation"... because it is then that Christ returns to gather his chosen ones "from the four extremities." What does that mean? It means that wherever they are... alive on earth or sleeping in the spirit realm... he gathers these.
How that gathering takes place is this:
A trumpet sounds (which trumpet is the voice of arkangel, Michael - Revelation 1:10; 4:4; 19:9, 10; 22:8, 9 - one of the two cherubs "on" the "Cover" (cover/propitiatory, which is Christ - Exodus 25:17; 1 John 2:2) of the Ark [of the Covenant] - Exodus 25:17-22; Ezekiel 28:13-15; Matthew 24:29-31;1 Thessalonians 4:16).
Christ returns "in [a] cloud(s)" - Matthew 24:30; Revelation 1:7 - and, no, they are not the cirrus or cumulus clouds that we see floating around in our sky. They are actually clouds of smoke (, but I am not at liberty to expound on that more, so let's just say it's clouds, because that was the only way to explain it then. So be it)... and upon doing so gathers his chosen ones in this way (Matthew 24:31):
The spirits of those who died in union with Christ, who belong to HIM... are resurrected (this is the FIRST resurrection – Revelation 6:9-1120:4-6)... and given "white robes"... spirit bodies... at the same time as the bodies of those who are in union with him but have NOT died... are changed (1 Thessalonians 4:15),.. to "white robes". These “robles”... are spirit bodies. The CLEAN “outer garment” (Zechariah 3:4). As a result, both groups "put on” (as one does with a robe!)... immortality... by means of putting on the "incorruptible" body of spirit. 1 Corinthians 15:51-55; 1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17).
In THIS way, Christ's words that HE is "the resurrection AND the life (John 14:6)" and that "he that exercises faith in ME... even though he DIES... will come to life; and everyone that is LIVING and exercises faith in ME... will NEVER die at all”... is fulfilled. The first part of this statement referring to those who die and are resurrected, the second to those who change... and so never see death. John 11:24-26
These include 144,000 from among the sons of Israel (some of whom will have died)... AND a great crowd from every nation, etc., which are unnumbered... and ALIVE at the time of the tribulation. Hence, they come OUT of that event. (NOTE: The crowd is unnumbered... because there is no set number – there is only a set TIME. Thus, just as when the door to the Ark was closed, so too, when the “Door” that is Christ, is “closed”... no more will be let in (Matthew 24:36-44; 25:1-12; note, this is NOT the marriage feast, but only the marriage ceremony. We can know this because they are still virgins, the marriage having not been consummated yet. The guests attend the feast, not the marriage ceremony, which involves the consummation and takes place in the Father’s house. And just as it was not known how many would be saved during Noah’s day – it turned OUT to be only 8... but could just have well been 9, 90, 9,000, etc. as folks had up and until the door was shut (by JAH) – so it will be, here).
Christ gathers these who belong to him, gives them “white robes”... spirit bodies... so that they are able to go WITH him to his Father's house... which is in the spirit realm (John 14:2-5; John 3:5)... where he is "married" (joined in spirit, as a man and woman join in flesh) to them. And during this time... the Adversary, Satan, is abyssed, locked up. For “a thousand years.” Matthew 22:1-20; John 14:2; Revelation 19:7, 8; 20:1-3
Once the marriage ceremony has concluded, Christ... and His Bride... return to the physical realm, for the marriage “feast” - “she” in the form of NEW Jerusalem (Revelation 21:2)... the City “having REAL foundations” (Hebrews 11:10)... meaning not handmade or made of earthly stones (Acts 17:24)... but made of PEOPLE... LIVING stones: Christ, the foundation cornerstone; the apostles and prophets are the foundation (as well as “gates” – the apostles); and others pillars and bricks (living stones) in “her.” (Ephesians 2:19-22; 1 Peter 2:4-6) She, New Jerusalem... is the TEMPLE of the MOST Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies (Psalm 68:4;1 Corinthians 3:16); HE will dwell in HER and by means of HER, the “tent” (temporary dwelling place) of God is with mankind. (Revelation 21:3) She, however, also has a “temple” IN her... but not a temple that is a “building” - God and Christ are the “temple” within her. THEY are the Holy and MOST Holy within her. (Revelation 21:22) Thus, she is a temple... that has within it a temple. And so she represents the City of DOUBLE peace.
When they return, when New Jerusalem “comes down out of heaven”... “she” establishes herself within the physical realm. And in her midst, in the “temple” that is within her... is the Tree of Life... Christ, the Holy [One of Israel]. He... the True Vine, Root of Jesse... Sprout! (Isaiah 11:10; Zechariah 5:12; John 14:6; 15:1; Revelation 22:1, 2).
Once New Jerusalem is established the time comes to receive guests to the feast. So, Christ and his Bride sit down on thrones... and begin separating out the guests: sheep from goats. The sheep are given “white robes”... spirit bodies... based on their good treatment of Christ, by means of their good treatment to the LEAST of his brothers and therefore some of who may not be of his Bride. By means of these bodies... they receive access to the City, through her “gates”. Not needing to be of strictly of Israel, these are anyone who “honor” the Son by means of honoring the least of his brothers.
The goats, however, are cut off from access... based on how THEY treated Christ’s brothers, as well. They are not permitted to attend the feast; however, they are also NOT destroyed at this time, but only cut off from entering into the “City”. Matthew 25:31-46
This “separating” takes place during the “thousand years” that Satan is abyssed. This is the period of their (144k AND great crowd) co-ruling as kings with Christ. That co-rulership also consists of them acting as PRIESTS... on behalf of the “sheep” who are ultimately given access to the City... and the Tree of Life (Christ) within it... and thus “rendering SACRED service”... in the “temple” of God, New Jerusalem. Revelation 5:9, 10; 7:9-15
During this time Babylon the Great, the kings of the earth, the false prophet, all continue their malarkey. At the END of the thousand years two (2) things take place: (1) their co-rulership ENDS... and (2) Satan is loosed... and he goes out to misled Gog... and Magog. (Revelation 20:7-9) Gog... are those “goats”, those humans who were cut off from entering the “City.” Magog are Satan’s angels (those spirit beings who, along with him, were hurled down out of the spirit realm to the physical realm, but were not confined...with him or otherwise; however, they are prohibited from re-entering the spirit realm - Revelation 12:7-12.
Satan misleads these using three “inspired expressions that look like frogs”. They look this way because the come from his (the dragon’s) mouth, the mouth of the “wild beast” and the mouth of the “false prophet.” He uses these to gather Gog, through the “kings of the earth,” and Magog... to “Har-Mageddon”, a “place”... just “outside” the City and its encampment. And it is there that God’s war... what most called “Armageddon”... takes place. It is not really a war, though, because JAH unilaterally destroys them, with fire from His own mouth (Psalm 18:8; Revelation 16:13, 16, 16; 20:7, 8
Why are they destroyed? Because Satan misleads them, Gog and Magog... by means of these demon-inspired expressions that deceive them... into believing that they CAN access the City. They want to do this... because they need to get to what’s INSIDE the City: the Tree of LIFE. From which, if they can eat... they will live FOREVER. Genesis 3:9, 22 And so they “come against” the Holy City, in an effort to attack, overcome, and gain access into it for this purpose.
But the MOST Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies, does not permit this. Previously, He used cherubs to block the way, but this time there are spirit beings also trying to gain access. And so He does what He must: destroys them... with fire (because fire is the only thing that can destroy spirits). By fire, He destroys them all: Gog (body AND spirit) and Magog (spirit), with fire from His mouth - Psalm 18:8; Daniel 7:10; Matthew 10:28 -and the wild beast, false prophet, and Satan... all spirits... by hurling them into the Lake of Fire. Revelation 20:9, 10
And then... the End. This is when the Judgment takes place... and the time frame is well AFTER the “thousand years” have ended – Revelation 20:7, 10. It is at this time that Christ hands the kingdom BACK to the Father. Because HE, Christ... judges NO MAN. Although he has the AUTHORITY to judge... and the POWER... he DOESN’T. Rather, he turns that task back over to the Father. Daniel 7:9, 10; 1 Corinthians 15:20-28; Revelation 20:11 It is here, after JAH, by means of His “war” at Har-Mageddon... has put Christ’s enemies under his feet (Psalm 110:1; 1 Corinthians 15:25), that the second resurrection... and Judgment... begins. Revelation 20:5
Then, the MOST Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies... takes His seat... and is given two (2) sets of scrolls: the “Book of Remembrance”, in which are held ALL the deeds of those to come before him (which does not include those who took part in the FIRST resurrection – Romans 8:1; Revelation 20:6)... and the “Lamb’s Book.” And then... the second resurrection: the sea give up those dead it in, and death and Hades (the grave) give up those dead in them... and such ones come before the Court. And what occurs is this:
The first book, the Book of Remembrance, contains ALL the deeds of those who come before the Court – good AND bad. The second (Lamb’s) Book contains the names of ALL those for whom the Lamb’s blood covers (those who did good to even the least one of Christ’s brothers... but died before the tribulation). For these, any bad deed(s) listed in the first Book... names are NOT found in the Lamb’s Book... and are NOT covered... NOT blotted out... remain. And so such ones are... must be... judged. Since they have no covering for their sins... they must pay the “wage” OF sin... which is everlasting death. Revelation 20:15 They are dare “covered”. Because of the MERCY of God and Christ. The blood of the Lamb “blots out” their sins from the first book. As a result, these are given life and... “inherit the kingdom”. They become the subjects of that kingdom, along with the “sheep” who attended the wedding feast.
Because the wage (cost/price) of sin is DEATH, however, the sins of any whose estroyed, subjected to the Second Death (Revelation 2:11; 20:14)... because although they died once, they did not have an atonement for their sins. Some will ask, “Well, why even bother to resurrect them? Why not leave them dead?” For two reason: there will be a resurrection of the righteous AND the unrighteous... the righteous to LIFE... and the unrighteous to judgment... and because although they died in the flesh, so that their vessel returned to the dust... their SPIRITS are not dead. They are only sleeping. If spirits can be resurrected then, who is to say that someone might not resurrect these at some point... and all of the “badness” start all over again. The MOST Holy One of Israel won’t take that chance – in creating a NEW heavens and a NEW earth... one must start with a CLEAN slate. Which means NO wickedness.
And so, they are resurrected yes... in body... and then done away with in body AND spirit. They are not tortured, or left burning: they are fully and completely destroyed. Body... and spirit.
Once this is completed... the MOST Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies, hands the kingdom BACK to His Son and Christ, the Holy One of Israel, JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH (MischaJah)... that that One, the Son, rules... forever. His kingdom will NEVER come to an end. Daniel 7:9, 10, 13, 14
I hope that puts it in order... and perspective... for you, dear Turtle.
Again, peace to you!
A slave of Christ,
SA
