Will they get rid of the FDS concept?

by Hermano 33 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Bobcat

    King Solomon said:

    Interestingly, the NWT is the ONLY translation that translates the phrase as, "faithful and DISCREET servant"; ALL the others translate it as "faithful and WISE servant".

    Just a compilation for the thought you made. Here is how the NWT translates in all its occurrances: (phronimos)

    Mt 7:24 Discreet
    Mt 10:16 Cautious
    Mt 24:45 Discreet
    Mt 25:2, 4, 8, 9 Discreet
    Lk 12:42 Discreet
    Lu 16:8 Practical wisdom
    Ro 11:25 Discreet
    Ro 12:16 Discreet
    1C 4:10 Discreet
    1C 10:15 Discernment
    2C 11:19 Reasonable

    Here is how various dictionarys define the word:

    AMG definition: (phronimos) to think, have a mindset. Prudent, sensible, practically wise in relationships with others (Mt 7:24; 10:16; 24:45; 25:2, 4, 8, 9; Lu 12:42; 16:8; 1Cor 10:15. In an evil sense, thinking oneself to be prudent or wise because of self-complacency (Rom 11:25; 12:16; used ironically in 1 Cor 4:10; 2Cor 11:19)

    BDAG definition: pertaining to understanding associated with insight and wisdom, sensible, thoughtful, prudent, wise.

    The New Strong's definition: thoughtful, i.e. sagacious or discreet (implying a cautious character)

    Vines definition: Prudent, sensible, practically wise

    Louw & Nida definition: Pertaining to understanding resulting from insight and wisdom - wise, wisely, with understanding, with insight

    Take Care

  • moshe


    JWs don't ask for the WT to give them the names of any F&DS and never have pushed to have the WT leadership explain how Jehoover does his spirtual mind meld with figurative annointed JWs, that in turn communicate their brighter light-bulb ideas to the GB., who in turn provide JWs with a spiritual earthly paradise- wt literature, books, videos, magazine assemblies, CO's, KH busy work, etc, etc!! Who needs material toys, college, a career, a family, etc , anyway, when you have that? I think JWs , deep down inside, know it's a scam, but they desperately need to keep believing in their spiritual santa claus class , anyway.

  • King Solomon
    King Solomon

    Hermano said:

    Seems to me the FDS argument is the weakest scriptural support for their authority.

    Yeah, but think back: when JWs knocked at your door, did you have the foresight to ask them about the scriptural basis for their leaders, even before you knew who they were? I'd doubt that anyone who possessed that foresight wouldn't just say, "Sorry, I'm not interested" and continue whatever it was they were doing.

    Bobcat, thanks for the info.

    If you check parallel translations of Matt 24:45, you see interpretations such as "wise, prudent, sensible".

    Greek concordance for phronimos shows 2 occurrances in the NT, at Matt 24:45 and in Luke 12:42, which is a retelling of the same parable, but with slight variation in Luke 12:47-48.

    47 “And that slave who knew his master’s will and did not get ready or act in accord with his will, will receive many lashes, 48 but the one who did not know it, and committed deeds worthy of a flogging, will receive but few. From everyone who has been given much, much will be required; and to whom they entrusted much, of him they will ask all the more.

    That's where the analogy falls apart: how could the GB NOT know the master's will, since the GB is SUPPOSED to be the link in the communication?

    Either way you cut it, though, it sounds like GB is in for a flogging once Jesus returns! :)

    BTW, I think I figured out why WTBTS shifted to using the word "discreet" after a certain time (not sure when? 1920s?), when all earlier references to FDS used the word "wise" (FWS).

    'Discreet' implies the slave having some special insight into the business affairs of the master which they must keep private, exercising discretion. The servant doesn't need to possess wisdom, per se, since he's supposed to follow the will of his servant. HOWEVER, the servant MAY know personal gossip and details of the business affairs of the master, which he is expected to keep secret. So the WTBTS is basically saying, "we've got a secret that Jesus told us..." ('Wise' doesn't convey that same sense.)

  • Hermano
    Yeah, but think back: when JWs knocked at your door, did you have the foresight to ask them about the scriptural basis for their leaders to lead, even before you knew who they were?

    I was born-in, so I can't answer that question. For me, it was all a given. Even the things I questioned, I sought answers for in the Watchtower publications. But if I had to try to explain it to someone else, I would not have gone with that scripture first because even then I understood that scripture wasn't clear/strong enough.

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