The Science Thread

by EntirelyPossible 65 Replies latest jw experiences

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  EntirelyPossible

  The model as given isn’t complicated enough to include a metal core.

  It's so complicated it requires uninvented technology yet you can't work in a metal core?

  Its prime purpose is to demonstrate that the convection currents in such a scenario would be entirely different than the standard convection currents that we are familiar with, such as those in a pan on the stove.

  That's already easily demonstrated. What need for this unworkable model?

  There are many factors involved in the earth’s makeup, and if convection currents are one of them, then it is only reasonable that examining their characteristics will tend to throw light on some of the lesser phenomena that could be caused or at least influenced by these convection currents, such as continental drift, earthquakes, and many more.

  Yes. Agreed. There is a whole branch of earth sciences that does with. With workable models. And using things like science.

  Yet, judging from sightings from the space station of jettisoned water that became ice, that apparently isn’t the case. Anyone have an idea of how that works?

  Yes. You should study up on that.

  That is indeed interesting! Do you know what evidence this is based on?

  Yes, you should study up on that.

  Both will grab some tiny morsel of truth, jump up in mid-air and build an entire castle of theory around it, then throw tantrums should anyone be so foolish to question its foundation.

  Right here demonstrates that you have no clue how science works. Science can't work unless it is questioned. No amount of word play with your folksy yet genius, humble yet bragging about how you survived one time (haven't we all survived to this point?) will gloss over the fact you aren't doing science, don't know how it works and are asking us to educate you rather than do the work yourself.

  Science doesn't reward laziness or ignorance.
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  Twitch

  Nothing to do with the topic at hand but I had a conversation today at work that reminded me of another some time ago.

  The guys in the band were on a break and we were discussing the cause of the seasons in terms of the position of the earth. Buddy said they're caused by the earth wobbling like a top with the northern and southern hemispheres alternating in having more surface area facing the sun creating summer and winter. I said yea it's true re the hemispheres but the earth doesn't "wobble" per se; it remains tilted at 23.5 degress off "vertical" (perpendicular to the plane of the ecliptic or orbital plane) spinning on this axis as it goes around the sun. At the summer solstice, the earth is at a position in it's orbit where the northern hemisphere is "closest" to the sun. Six months later it's on the other side of it's orbit, it's now winter in the northern hemisphere and the the axis of the earth is still "pointed" the same way relative to it's first position. Relative to the sun it's been reversed and following this motion relative to the sun over a year, it appears the earth "wobbles" but this isn't entirely accurate. My buddy just couldn't see what I was trying to say and insisted the earth wobbles. The other guys seemed a little more perceptive of it but remained neutral, lol.

  A picture is worth a thousand words and it's unfortunate we didn't have access at the time.

  

  When you look at it really, both perceptions of the idea are essentially correct in terms of cause and effect. I however, maintain the position that the earth does not wobble, per se ;)
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  LoneWolf

  EP – LOL!! An’ a vary marry berthdae tooyew two, Ned!

  Which reminds me – how long were you an elder? The long-term effects of being one take a long time recover from, and many never do. You have my sympathy.

  If the day ever comes that you learn what thought is, please let me know.

  Twitch – I’ve seen things like these too. I threw a mental problem like that out to my physics class one time involving a tire running down the road, and about 3 or 4 of my classmates could see it immediately. All the rest were having fits saying basically what Ned has been saying about the model I posted here. The ones who could see it immediately tried defending it and the resulting rip-roaring argument was funnier than all get out! I just sat back and enjoyed it. LOL!!

  Finally the teacher, fearing that it was about to descend into a riot, brought everything to a screeching halt and diagrammed the thing out on the blackboard so that everyone could see why I was right in my statement of the problem. By this time, though, those opposed had their prides involved and they wouldn’t admit I had a point even if the angels came down out of heaven and sang it to them in ten part harmony. They were all bent out of shape, calling me an idiot and a bunch of other stuff. The teacher straightened them out in a hurry. “No, he’s not! He’s right!” Just like Ned above, it took them a while to get over it.

  If something like that comes up again involving the seasons, try using a ball. Use your observer’s head as the sun, hold the ball at about 23 degrees to the vertical, then walk around him, keeping the ball in the same position. Most people can see it then.

  As an item of interest, though, there actually is a wobble in the earth’s spinning! It’s called the “Chandler wobble” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chandler_wobble , and it’s very, very small, but it’s real. There are a lot of theories as to why it exists, ranging from an unequal distribution of weight (similar to a tire being out of balance) to the movement of the liquid portions of the earth, to other things. What fascinates me about it is that it’s not a constant, but it varies from decade to decade.

  There are so many things that we don’t know, but would be fascinating to learn!
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  EntirelyPossible

  Which reminds me – how long were you an elder? The long-term effects of being one take a long time recover from, and many never do. You have my sympathy.

  I was never an elder. Or an MS. I know you thought you had a sure fire zinger there, but like your model, it requires a little knowledge a research to come up with a good one.
• 

  Twitch

  If something like that comes up again involving the seasons, try using a ball. Use your observer’s head as the sun, hold the ball at about 23 degrees to the vertical, then walk around him, keeping the ball in the same position. Most people can see it then.

  Good idea. i used a slide and my fist as the sun at the time but buddy wasn't buying it (oddly enough) though this is where the guitarist/math teacher clued in. The drummer said nothing...

  As an item of interest, though, there actually is a wobble in the earth’s spinning! It’s called the “Chandler wobble” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chandler_wobble , and it’s very, very small, but it’s real. There are a lot of theories as to why it exists, ranging from an unequal distribution of weight (similar to a tire being out of balance) to the movement of the liquid portions of the earth, to other things. What fascinates me about it is that it’s not a constant, but it varies from decade to decade.

  Cool, thanks for the 411; I'll check it out.

  There are so many things that we don’t know, but would be fascinating to learn!

  Ya. I've always been fascinated by astronomy from a layman's perspective. Never owned a telescope; would be pretty cool though. Funny thing, seeing the stuff is almost secondary to understanding how it works. The real kick is conceptualizing the relative motions of the planets and stars, seeing them not as static objects but as the movie that repeats itself yet continually changes in time and space. Trying to bridge the gap between the first person celestial sphere perspective and a third person perspective. Taking a trip beginning with leaving and orbiting the earth, to the moon and how two bodies "fall around" each other dancing to the tune of Kepler and Newton (among others ;) to the sun and how the three interact thus amping up the volume substantially, to the other planets and how they factor in and affect, to the whole system relative to the "background" stars which all have motion of their own and the dynamics of the galaxies and how they interact. Nothing is static and is relative to everything else, from atoms to the cosmos and the odd run-on sentence.

  It's hard to translate between the "looking up" perception and the mind's eye perspective of what's really going on. Mental exercise if nothing else, or perhaps just mental, lol. Fascinating though ;)
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  EntirelyPossible

  Given the threads where science it utterly misunderstood, seemed like a good idea to revive this thread...