I've never seen a DF person cause a disruption so I've never seen a DF person asked to leave. I don't even understand the point of the question really.
Survey - Are DF'ed ones allowed to be around for the prayers at the meetings where you live?
by StandFirm 25 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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NewChapter
Or this was this one time a DF'd person stayed for prayer, Jehovah sent his angel of death and plague started killing off men, women and chldren until one brave elder skewered the offender through the genitals and stopped the plague. A lot of lives were saved that day.
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Awen
It's not that they aren't allowed, it more that they are encouraged to leave during the prayer...to sneak out so as to not disturb everyone else. I had this said to me when I attended the KH in Moline, IL I thought it was dumb because it snows there 9 months out of the year and I had to wait outside for my ride and you know how that goes, everyone standing around and comparing suits /dresses and giving insincere praise for comments made during the meeting.
Peace and Love,
Awen
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SweetBabyCheezits
Or this was this one time a DF'd person stayed for prayer, Jehovah sent his angel of death and plague started killing off men, women and chldren until one brave elder skewered the offender through the genitals and stopped the plague. A lot of lives were saved that day.
Nice, NC! I actually pictured the valiant elder snatching a boom mic from an awkward-looking lad before impaling the sinner with it. That just made my night.
We thank you, Jehobo, for your acts of undeserved kindness!
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Witness My Fury
Well in Wales we do things OUR way, so having a row of inverted crucifx in the car park just always seemed normal to us. If any DF dared to intrude on the prayer then they KNEW what was coming to 'em they did! Deterrence worked 90% of the time, but you'd always get one smart ass who thought we were joking or that they'd be treated differently. Well let me tell you, their being nailed on upside down soon put any such notions aside in a jiffy!
Happy times.....
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noni1974
Oh there was this one time at band camp.... wait what was the question??
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blondie
I have lived in the western US, midwestern, southern, and eastern, and Europe and never seen it officially in writing that df'd people cannot be present for prayer. Could there be a rogue elder or BOE as was stated, yes, but not in any of the congregations I have attended. As long as df'd are well-behaved and do not try to approach the rank and file, they are welcome.
Some also have seen df'd relegated to the back rows or side rooms, but I have never seen that. I have seen df'd family sit with non-df'd family.
There even had to be a QFR saying that the df'd did not have to travel in separate cars.
*** w59 7/15 p. 448 Questions From Readers ***
If an individual is disfellowshiped, but continues in quiet attendance at the Kingdom Hall, is it proper for that one’s marriage mate to sit with such a one during the meetings?—J. F., Switzerland.
With a view to helping sincerely repentant ones to get back into proper relationship with Jehovah God and his organization, it has been the policy of the Society to permit disfellowshiped persons to be present at all meetings at the Kingdom Hall that are open to the general public. For married persons Jesus set out the proper viewpoint when he said: "Did you not read that he who created them at the beginning made them male and female and said: ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh’? So that they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has yoked together let no man put apart." (Matt. 19:4-6) This rule would seem to apply at the Kingdom Hall as well as elsewhere. In view of this it would seem to be improper to force a separation between a man and his wife even if one or the other is disfellowshiped. This is not having fellowship spiritually on the part of the faithful one with the disfellowshiped partner. However, it would be wrong for the individual who is in good standing to try to force the company of the disfellowshiped mate upon the other brothers and sisters in the congregation in the endeavor to have them recognize the disfellowshiped one and have communion with that one.
*** w53 4/1 p. 223 Questions From Readers ***
In this section of the November 15, 1952, Watchtower it was stated: "The faithful marriage partner would not discuss religion with the apostate or disfellowshiped and would not accompany that one to his (or her) place of religious association and participate in the meetings with that one." Does this mean that if the man of the house is disfellowshiped, but attends the meetings at the Kingdom Hall, the faithful members of the family may not ride with him in the family car when he drives there?—O. G., Kansas.
No, that is not the point TheWatchtower was making. It said faithful members of the family "would not accompany that one to his (or her) place of religious association and participate in the meetings with that one". Since the disfellowshiped one is no longer a participant in the meetings at the Kingdom Hall, and since it is no longer his rightful place of religious association, he having been disconnected from that association by disfellowshiping, and in attendance at Kingdom Hall now, not by invitation or welcome but by his unwanted intrusion, TheWatchtower was not referring to his coming to Kingdom Hall meetings when it spoke of not accompanying him to his place of religious association. It meant that the faithful one would not accompany the disfellowshiped one to another religious group with which the disfellowshiped one might associate and in whose meetings he might participate. It is all right for the faithful members of the family to ride with the disfellowshiped one in a car bound for the Kingdom Hall, but upon arrival the faithful ones should not sit with or associate with the disfellowshiped one at the hall, but rejoin him only when departing for home.
*** w59 7/15 p. 448 Questions From Readers ***
If an individual is disfellowshiped, but continues in quiet attendance at the Kingdom Hall, is it proper for that one’s marriage mate to sit with such a one during the meetings?—J. F., Switzerland.
With a view to helping sincerely repentant ones to get back into proper relationship with Jehovah God and his organization, it has been the policy of the Society to permit disfellowshiped persons to be present at all meetings at the Kingdom Hall that are open to the general public. For married persons Jesus set out the proper viewpoint when he said: "Did you not read that he who created them at the beginning made them male and female and said: ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and his mother and will stick to his wife, and the two will be one flesh’? So that they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore, what God has yoked together let no man put apart." (Matt. 19:4-6) This rule would seem to apply at the Kingdom Hall as well as elsewhere. In view of this it would seem to be improper to force a separation between a man and his wife even if one or the other is disfellowshiped. This is not having fellowship spiritually on the part of the faithful one with the disfellowshiped partner. However, it would be wrong for the individual who is in good standing to try to force the company of the disfellowshiped mate upon the other brothers and sisters in the congregation in the endeavor to have them recognize the disfellowshiped one and have communion with that one.
*** w63 7/15 p. 445 Family Responsibilities in Keeping Jehovah’s Worship Pure ***When attending congregation meetings at the Kingdom Hall, husband and wife, together with children, are to remain together and not be separated because one is disfellowshiped. There is no spiritual communication involved here. They are merely sitting together as a family. This family bond must not be tampered with.
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But at conventions and assemblies, I have seen jws in "good standing" get there after the prayer and leave before the prayer.
*** km 5/92 p. 3 par. 3 1992 "Light Bearers" District Convention ***By taking in all the sessions and remaining for the closing song and prayer, we gain the full benefit of the program and show our appreciation for our privilege of serving as light bearers.
*** km 4/83 p. 8 Question Box ***Encourage everyone to be there to share in the opening song and prayer and to remain to benefit from the closing prayer.
*** km 9/71 p. 2 Your Service Meetings ***New ones at meetings or assemblies judge us by our courtesy, consideration, orderliness. How are we doing in our congregation meetings? It is good to be there at start, if possible, and beneficial and respectful to stay through closing song and prayer.
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palmtree67
** feeds StandFirm a doggie biscuit **
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steve2
So, let's get this straight, if DFéd ones leave before prayers and those in good standing also leave before prayers, who's left to listen to the droning? Oh, no one. Well at least the rank and file appear to have got one thing right: The ineffable uselessness of prayers.
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diamondiiz
It's been a while since I noticed a df person at the hall. I believe in Ontario congregation there was someone that came in after a song and prayer and left before the ending part. Might have been Alberta congregation just after I moved there ('93) so either way it's been a long time ago but I know there was a congregation that had df people come in late and leave early.
I don't know if this action was by choice or not.