The Hobbit and Evolution: So What's Up With That?

by AGuest 125 Replies latest jw friends

AGuest

Greetings, all, and may you all have peace! First, my apologies for the absence/delay in responding. My "cold" is turning out to be something more (potential post-surgery respiratory problem) and has knocked me on my butt big time. Yes, I have a doctor appt., Wednesday. Since I am feeling quite puny, I'm not going to do my usual bump-by-bump. I am only going to say/respond to the following:
Shelby; the text: "... several scientist/anthropologist/paleontologist admissions that there is actually very little known about... and in evidence to support... evolution."... from your OP is not uttered in the programme, the trailers, or appears in written form anywhere other than here. You may believe this is a fair summary of the programme. You are wrong.
That's incorrect, dear Abaddon (peace to you!). Here is what I posted:
Hubby and I happened to catch an episode of "Nova" last night. Fascinating stuff. Seems there's a bit of a threat to the "concrete" theories of evolution, man's origination in Africa, and hominid species. What was most interesting is several scientist/anthropologist/paleontologist admissions that there is actually very little known about... and in evidence to support... evolution. That was surprising.
First, during the program, the statement was made that "there is actually very little known about... and in evidence to support... evolution" My recollection is that at least three commentators made this statement AND said that "several"... scientists, anthropologists, paleontologist, were of this position. I did not "quote" the statement as (1) it was made by more than one commentator, the names/credentials/expertise of whom I did not note; and (2) I did not include a link to the program itself (I don't now how to do that). I DID "quote" subsequent statements (from the CBS article) because I was able to link the article. Now, if you want to take issue with me that I did not do this pursuant to "university" standard, so be it. I will cop to that. It wasn't that big of a deal to me because, as I stated, it wasn't about evolution... but about the hypocrisy of [primarily] those HERE... who want to hold others to a standard they can't uphold themselves. You know, speaking of standards and all.
Second, that you are now turning this into an issue/discussion regarding my son's health care (vs. why I made the choices I did) is moot. You entirely missed the point. Well, I know you didn't, truly, but I cannot allow you to continue with this very smelly red herring. You took issue because I didn't related the entire event... and now you're trying to turn the even into the subject of this post, which it isn't. I realize that some "intelligent" folks believe themselves to be SO intelligent that they can do what you're trying to do and the rest of us idjits won't see it happening. But... you're not THAT intelligent, dear one. Your herring stinks. To high heaven.
Dear, dear NVL... peace to you, dear one... and two things: first, why are you posting as "Entirely Possible"? I mean, I quite GLAD that you are; it's an improvement, isn't it, from "Not Very Likely"? Second, I told you the truth: you have a drinking problem. While you may having taken the time you spent away from the board to get a grip on it... and I am sorry I had to be the one to point the truth out to you... you really should just own it and move on. No one hear is judging you; certainly not me.
Dear Curtains... peace to you, as well! I am not aware of having shared something with you that was untrue, truly. I realize that you may be doing as dear NVL and now posting under a new avatar, but, well, that would make sense. Do you care to elaborate? Thank you and, again, peace to you!
Dear Still Thinking... thank you. That really was my point. As I stated, (1) my post really wasn't about evolution, and (2) I do believe in evolution, excluding human evolution. Even so... my post wasn't about evolution but about the hypocrisy of the respective camps. That was it; that was all.
Finally, to those atheists, evolutionists, science groupies, and others who at least tried to hear me and get my point... thank you! It bothers me that many in religion totally disregard all that is "science", just as much as it bothers me that many who denounce religion (and I am one) totally disregard all that is "spiritual". And the two (religion and spiritual) are NOT synonymous, not at all. Funny, in another thread, some were willing to admit that there could be "spiritual" experiences without God. I am curious as to how that is... as to what folks believe "spiritual" truly is. I think I will ask that question in another post.
As for this post, I thinking I will end the "hosing" contest here. Some of us just don't see eye to eye. Who says we have to? Certainly not me. You don't like what I believe? Don't like what I say occurs with me? That is your right. I don't take issue. But please... PLEASE... do not think that your chiding, ridiculing, and sarcastic words will cause me to go, "Oh, wait! I don't want folks talking to me like that, so I'd better go along with what they say I SHOULD believe." Sorry, but that doesn't work with me. To the contrary, that literally SMACKS of my former experience with the WTBTS, where anyone who couldn't "see" the "logic"... or "truth" of what THEY believed... was a silly, "uneducated" idiot who didn't know what was "best" for them. IMHO, there is absolutely NO difference. And it's all hypocritical... from those who do it in BOTH camps.
Again, peace to you all!
A slave of Christ,
SA
EntirelyPossible

First, during the program, the statement was made that "there is actually very little known about... and in evidence to support... evolution"
That is clearly not correct. I am sure they didn't make the statement including the ellipsis' that you added in. It seemd you are adding or taking away or attempting to paraphrase on a subject you clearly aren't educated in.
It wasn't that big of a deal to me because, as I stated, it wasn't about evolution... but about the hypocrisy of [primarily] those HERE... who want to hold others to a standard they can't uphold themselves. You know, speaking of standards and all.
So you were innaccurate and not educated on in a thread you started to talk about standards? Pot, kettle, etc.
Dear, dear NVL... peace to you, dear one... and two things: first, why are you posting as "Entirely Possible"? I mean, I quite GLAD that you are; it's an improvement, isn't it, from "Not Very Likely"?
It's quite good to see you too! I have my reasons for posting under this name. They aren't that important.
Second, I told you the truth: you have a drinking problem. While you may having taken the time you spent away from the board to get a grip on it... and I am sorry I had to be the one to point the truth out to you... you really should just own it and move on.
I didn't take time away from the board for any reason. You told me LOTS of things your Lord told you, all of them wrong. Interesting that you would pick that one to bring up. Perhaps the lady doth protest too much? I in fact own EVERYTHING about me. I embrace it. Interesting that you would think I don't.
No one hear is judging you; certainly not me.
I know and appreciate that. I think you happen to be batshit crazy, but I love you nonetheless and would help you out any way I could given the chance. We all have our issues. Mine is primarily being an impatient judgemental asshole that leaps before he looks.
It bothers me that many in religion totally disregard all that is "science", just as much as it bothers me that many who denounce religion (and I am one) totally disregard all that is "spiritual".
Well that is certainly something we can agree on!
AGuest

That is clearly not correct. I am sure they didn't make the statement including the ellipsis' that you added in. It seemd you are adding or taking away or attempting to paraphrase on a subject you clearly aren't educated in.
Omigosh... what is WRONG with you people? Watch the show (and peace to you, dear NVL)!!! Use your "On Demand" or go online... or do what you have to/can do... but WATCH it before you try to tell me what was or was not said! Seriously!
So you were innaccurate and not educated on in a thread you started to talk about standards? Pot, kettle, etc.
See above... and look in the mirror. I mean, good gosh, YOUR hypocrisy astounds me. I mean, the least you could do is watch the dang show before you tell me what was/was not said on it.
It's quite good to see you too! I have my reasons for posting under this name. They aren't that important.
I'm sure you do... and I'm sure they aren't. Just surprising, coming from someone who made such a big deal about having nothing to hide, per se. I mean, post as EP, sure. But why not let folks know who you really are?
I didn't take time away from the board for any reason. You told me LOTS of things your Lord told you, all of them wrong. Interesting that you would pick that one to bring up. Perhaps the lady doth protest too much? I in fact own EVERYTHING about me. I embrace it. Interesting that you would think I don't.
Well, no, I didn't mean that you CHOSE to take time away... just perhaps what you might have used the time for. I stand by what I heard and shared.
I know and appreciate that. I think you happen to be batshit crazy, but I love you nonetheless and would help you out any way I could given the chance. We all have our issues. Mine is primarily being an impatient judgemental asshole that leaps before he looks.
(BIG SMILE)
Well that is certainly something we can agree on!
And there you GO! Perhaps you and I should stick to subject we agree on. You know, so as not to go back down the road we once did...
Peace to you, dear NVL... and I am VERY glad to see that you appear to be doing okay. Folks were concerned about you...
A slave of Christ,
SA
tec

I think this is the program - at least its on this page and you just have to click it (alien from earth?). I'm about to watch it. Let me know if it isn't the same one, Shelby:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/evolution/alien-earth.html
AGuest

Yes, it is, dear tec (peace to you!), and my apologies for taking so long to respond but I had to watch it again to be sure. Dear Abaddon was correct (peace to you, as well!): it was not a "quote" but what I pieced together from what three commentators (a writer, anthropologist, and paleoanthropologist) said. That was irresponsible and I apologize to the board.
However, if anyone watched the program, perhaps they will see as to my point: that what we "know" as "fact" regarding human evolution is subject to change, too (one camp believes Hobbit is a human species and states it as fact, another does not and denies the "fact")... and so to call out folks from other camps who change THEIR "facts" is hypocrisy. BOTH camps could just as well say, "We don't know, but what we THINK is..." IF that is what they're demanding of the other. Unless, of course, they truly do know. Given the holes... and possibilities (i.e., undiscovered/misunderstood species/beings) in this subject, I don't know how they can say, for sure.
BUT... that does not excuse my error and, again, I sincerely apologize.
Thank you for finding the program!
Again, peace to you!
Your servant, sister, and fellow slave of Christ,
SA
tec

It was very interesting. I watched it with a tea, and a bowl of frosted flakes (sans milk) :)
Personally, I thought it raised more questions than anything else; and showed us just how much of the puzzle we are actually missing... something admitted in the program. I don't need to add my opinion about the possible conclusions, since there were so many different possibilities presented :). But I found myself agreeing with the one scientist who claimed that it was 'island phenomenon' and in the next moment nodding my head with the scientist who said that the bone structure didn't support that because there was no sign of 'shrinking'.
Infants is what we are in our knowledge. There is so much more we need to discover, and who knows where all of that might take us... at least in our understanding.
Tammy
AGuest

Indeed, dear one (peace to you!). Wasn't it a lot of back and forth? And didn't you want to agree with everyone, because everyone seemed to make "sense"? LOLOLOLOL! I put my faith/trust in earthling man once... twice... many times. He always seems to "change" what he believes/knows/understands, though... and take issue with you for not keeping up/following suit. I just can't do it anymore. My Lord never changes. Neither did he direct me to the show or to make this post - and you know what can happen when one leans on one's own understanding, which I did here. I really should learn to stick with him and not venture out on my own, so much - LOLOLOLOL! Ah, well...
Again, thank you and peace to you!
YOUR servant, sister, and fellow slave of Christ,
SA
tec

And didn't you want to agree with everyone, because everyone seemed to make "sense"? LOLOLOLOL!
Yes. I was laughing at myself.
Peace to you, too,
Tammy

Curtains

aguest

Dear Curtains... peace to you, as well! I am not aware of having shared something with you that was untrue, truly. I realize that you may be doing as dear NVL and now posting under a new avatar, but, well, that would make sense. Do you care to elaborate? Thank you and, again, peace to you!

after your treatment of entirelypossible, I don't care to elaborate. If the Lord blinds you to other people's truth who am I to stand in the way.

edit: what a shame that program is not available here.

there you go again

However, if anyone watched the program, perhaps they will see as to my point: that what we "know" as "fact" regarding human evolution is subject to change, too (one camp believes Hobbit is a human species and states it as fact, another does not and denies the "fact")... and so to call out folks from other camps who change THEIR "facts" is hypocrisy. BOTH camps could just as well say, "We don't know, but what we THINK is..." IF that is what they're demanding of the other. Unless, of course, they truly do know. Given the holes... and possibilities (i.e., undiscovered/misunderstood species/beings) in this subject, I don't know how they can say, for sure.

perhaps this is just your rhetoric from your legal training. If this is the case I can't understand why your supporters jump up and down when anyone takes you to task aguest.

AGuest

Greetings, dear Curtains... and peace to you!
Please overlook my interchange with EntirelyPossible, if you can. He and I have a bit of a history that may actually predate your participation on the board (maybe not, though, as you may have posted as someone else previously, too. But he knows where I'm coming from, I assure you.)
I must admit that I'm not sure what you mean by "there you go again." Really. I'm being sincere. Admittedly, I'm not the brightest crayon in the box, so you may need to clarify.
I can't understand why your supporters jump up and down when anyone takes you to task aguest.
You know, I'm not sure I see what you do. I do realize that there are some who do support me and who try and clarify, a bit more concisely, what I might be trying to say. I am verbose, I do not deny, and so sometimes my point gets lost in my plethora of words. That's on me, though, not them. But I can't say I agree that anyone "jump[s] up and down"... except perhaps when the attack is against me personally. I promise you, though, that these same dear people would do the same for you were you a friend of theirs. While they don't all agree with me or my beliefs, they are fiercely loyal. Which id born of love... and is a virtue, dear one, not a sin.
If they DO jump up and down (which I will concede, as you are entitled to your opinion and viewpoint), then I would wager that it is not due so much to that I am being taken to task... but HOW I am taken to task. Some folks just don't have the stomach for... well, outright meanness... which is what occurs quite often.
I hope that helps you better understand, dear one, and, again, peace to you!
YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,
SA

The Hobbit and Evolution: So What's Up With That?

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