New 'light' or flip flop on wild beast/image of the wild beast

by Anony Mous 23 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Anony Mous
    Anony Mous

    Something that I noticed a couple of weeks ago regarding the identity of the wild beast. The DO said that the wild beast is the 'the world's failed political systems that do not acknowledge Jehovah's authority. I always understood that it was the UN. Off course I was 'encouraged' to do 'bible study', prayer and service.

    WT 2/15/2009:“The wisdom from above” helps us to understand “the mystery of the woman and of the [scarlet-colored] wild beast that is carrying her.” (Jas. 3:17) This symbolic wild beast began as the League of Nations and was later revived as the United Nations. Should not the unraveling of this mystery move us to be zealous in preaching the good news of God’s Kingdom and proclaiming the day of Jehovah’s judgment.

    It seems to me that this is 'the wisdom from above' aka directly inspired from the big man in the clouds. So this cannot be changed any further [sarcasm].

    WT 3/15/2007: The apostle John was given a vision that provides the answer. John relates: “I saw the wild beast [the world’s political system] and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to wage the war with the one [Jesus] seated on the horse and with his army.”

    WT 10/1/2005: “The wild beast and its image” are symbols of human rulership, which does not acknowledge Jehovah’s sovereignty.

    IP-1 Ch 5 par. 14 (2000): including the United Nations, the “scarlet-colored wild beast” of Revelation chapter 17; references Revelation - Climax book.

    Ch 25 par. 10: Notice that the scarlet-colored wild beast “is also itself an eighth king.” Thus, the United Nations today is designed to look like a world government. At times it has even acted like one, sending armies into the field to resolve international disputes, as in Korea, the Sinai Peninsula, some African countries, and Lebanon. But it is only the image of a king. Like a religious image, it has no real influence or power apart from what is invested in it by those who brought it into existence and worship it.

    Revelation - Climax (1988) teaches that the wild beast whoms head was cut off and healed in Revelation 13 gave breath to the image of the wild beast which re-appears as the scarlet colored wild beast in Revelation 17.

    The Bible Teach book (the book that's supposed to get you to baptism these days) doesn't mention it at all even though I think it would be important for JW Eschatology. What you can 'understand' until 2000 was the (scarlet colored beast === the image of the wild beast) and (wild beast != image of the wild beast) and (image of the wild beast == United Nations). Yet a head of the original wild beast was cut off which is explained as the League of Nations going into the United Nations. But if you still follow me and wrap your head around it, the head of the image (the LoN and the UN) wasn't cut off at all but the wild beast (the political system of this world) had a head cut off. 1 head was one of the 7 kings, not all it's heads were damaged and the UN/World Government of the Last Days is the 8th king which is the whole beast.

    Any of you lying, cheating, mindclouding, poisonous apostates (that were some of the choice words in the 'warning against everything modern in this world talk' the DO had in another talk) or genuine JW that won't label me as apostate for questioning the 'logic' would like to explain.

    For those that are interested, the United Nations as a 'bad' organization and the 'wild beast' hasn't appeared in publications since 2000 except for the regurgitated (copied from the WTLIB) content about what we can learn from Revelations in the 2007 WatchTower which might have been a goof by a youngling in Patterson.

  • Witness My Fury
    Witness My Fury

    Not 100% sure what you are asking, but I think you may be wanting clarification on the (current) WTS understanding of the Wild Beast and its Image?

    Wild Beast = political systems

    Image = UN

    Edit to add,...

    Aha! I spotted the fact the publications quoted SWITCH between the two as applying the UN tag to the WILD BEAST lately. That would previously have been incorrect. (wtf?)

  • jookbeard

    that was a very kind selection of words from your DO Anony,charming guy!

  • saltyoldlady

    Now your DO just wouldn't be judging and condemning would he? Maybe he tore Luke 6:37 out of his Bible. I'll work on releasing - needed something more to work on these days - since leaving the WTS I've gotten a little rusty there.

  • DesirousOfChange

    Rev. 13:1, 2 -- WILD BEAST with body of a leopard, 7 heads & 10 horns, 10 diadems, coming out of the SEA (Revelation Climax book Pg 189) = All Political Powers

    Rev. 13: 11-13 -- TWO-HORNED WILD BEAST, ascending out of the EARTH, two horns like a lamb, speaking as a dragon, tells those on the earth to make an IMAGE OF THE WILD BEAST (Revelation book Pg 193) = Anglo-American World Power in the Time of the End

    Rev. 13:14, 15 -- IMAGE OF THE WILD BEAST, scarlet colored (Revelation Book Pg 195) = League of Nations and subsequently United Nations

    Current understanding as of " today"

  • ProdigalSon

    He is intoxicated, but not with wine. ~Isaiah 29.

  • elderelite

    Wow... Make sure you tell your DO i said hi.

  • moshe
    which does not acknowledge Jehovah's sovereignty.

    JWs acknowledge Jehovah's Sovereignty- well, sorta, except when they need a handout from the Salvation Army, except when they need help from the Red Cross, except when they need groceries from the church sponsored food pantry, except when they need free low-income medical care from Caesar, etc, etc. Since they rely of Jehoobah's promised future kingdom rule, they don't need no stinking retirement plan, or pension plan, no siree, they can get by on a $600/mo Social Secuirty check and keep on washing windows and cleaning carpets until the new order arrives- sometime in the next 20-30-40 years, thanks to the new overlapping generations teaching, which gives JWs lots more time to keep on preaching the Good News of the (delayed again) Kingdom.

  • factfinder

    The UN is the "image" of the wild beast.

    Has something changed? If so it will be in the w. it would be interesting if they change the identity of the UN but as far as I know they haven't.

    Am I missing something? I'm tired!

  • Anony Mous
    Anony Mous

    Yes, something has changed. None of the outlines for talks include references to the UN as the wild beast and now state "the wild beast and its image are symbols of failed human rulership that do not accept Jehovah's sovereignty", the publications have been quiet about the UN for ~10 years except as I said, a copy-paste out of previous publications in 2005 and that statement about the (what I call 'new') identity of the beast was repeatedly stated (3 or 4 times if you paid attention) at the last set of assemblies. The scarlet colored beast is still the UN (actually - no mention of it nor a change in it's identity).

    Another thing that I noticed is and didn't explain well in publications is that they state the 'wild beast' that has some type of mortal wound and was healed is the world's political systems however they then go on to explain that the wound the beast suffered is when the League of Nations was healed into the UN. However the bible text goes on to explain that only after the mortal wound the two horned beast breathes life into the image of the wild beast which they explain as the creation of the League of Nations/UN which has no power as it is an image just like images of God's have no power.

    So there seems to be already a discrepancy (for years now) into the verses and the explanations that depending on what part of the verses you are reading, the identity of the beast itself changes from political systems (the first part of Rev 13) into the LoN/UN (the mortal wound part of Rev 13) and back (the latter part of Rev 13 where the political systems are and Anglo/America creates the wild beast's image which becomes the UN) and then the scarlet beast is again equated into the UN which IS the same beast as the beast that was, was not and was again. The harlot does not ride on the image of the wild beast, the harlot rides on the wild beast according to scripture. And then they wonder why we have such hard time understanding and explaining Revelations. Something else to note in the literature of the WT Rev 13 and 17 are never explained in the same paragraph/small article. They are always broken up in separate chapters or articles.

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