WT Society wants Elders to Conceal Information to Psychiatrists- Elders Bk.

by flipper 58 Replies latest jw friends

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  flipper

  My wife and I have read carefully through Chapter 5 of the new elders manual when we do our " personal study " in bed on Saturday mornings ! So I felt it important to address this controlling information put out in Chapter 4 pg. 55 because it shows how the WT society is paranoid about ANY dirty laundry getting out to outside authority figures, whether it be police, psychiatrists, or ANYBODY who may expose indecent or improper conduct happening inside Jehovah's Witness congregations. Even IF such conduct may break the laws of the land resulting in needed intervention from outside " worldly " authorities.

  So without further delay , notice this quote from the new elders manual, " There are times when an emotionally distressed Christian may seek professional help. Whether a Christian or his family pursues treatment from psychiatrists , psychologists, or therapists is a personal decision. An elder should not assume the responsibility of RECOMMENDING a specific practioner or facility. He may draw attention to or discuss material IN THE PUBLICATIONS that provides CAUTIONS REGARDING THERAPIES that may conflict with Bible principles. ( WTF ? ) While participating in group therapy by a professional therapist is a matter for personal decision, there could be a REVEALING OF CONFIDENTIAL FACTS ABOUT OTHER MEMBERS OF THE CONGREGATION during such sessions if a Christian DOES NOT EXERCISE DISCRETION. "

  Let's break this down. So elders are told to ONLY give counsel to emotionally troubled witnesses from the WT publications ? How does THAT help the troubled person ? What if the individual NEEDS professional therapy or counseling from a liscenced psychiatrist ? Here is another angle to consider : What if a emotionally troubled ELDER has had to go to a professional therapist for counseling for depression and received help & benefits by such counseling ? So according to this book he is NOT allowed to recommend a therapist who might have helped him ? That is the message given by this information. An elder is ONLY allowed to give WT society publications information to counsel a depressed Jehovah's Witness. This is dangerous. The WT society is messing with people's lives and mental health. Is it any wonder so many witnesses remain in a depressed state ?

  Now- to my other point. The WT society rears it's ugly head in being a paranoid mind control cult by DISSING JW members who may reveal confidential matters to a psychiatrist about OTHER JW's. What does the WT society have to hide ? Could it be they are concerned about depressed JW's revealing THESE types of " confidential " matters that occur inside the Jehovah's Witness organization ? Child abuse, blood transfusions on minors without the child's consent, shunning of family members promoted by disfellowshipping, dissassociating, or even inactive members stopping attending meetings . Also injustices commited by elders towards rank & file members - unjust decisions , lies, gossiping, inaccurate character assault , slander, misrepresentation of REAL facts. ALL of these situations could possibly be revealed by a depressed Jehovah's Witness to a psychiatrist . Need I say more ?

  Bottom line is the WT society is running scared. They are VERY concerned about HOW MUCH information gets out to public authority figures regarding WHAT REALLY goes on inside their congregations of Jehovah's Witnesses. They are basically a " closed society " or a mind control cult who is hell bent on protecting it's assets which translates into it's members which translates into $$$$$ to keep 130 + years of deception continuing. So- Just my 2 cents. So what do YOU folks think about this information in the new elders manual ? Have you had any experiences that kind of go along with what is being discussed here ? As always- I look forward to your comments and takes on this. ALL of us have to protect ourselves from ANY manipulative organizations bent on taking our freedoms away. Take care all of you, Peace out to all, Mr. Flipper
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  OnTheWayOut

  I hate all things JW, but let us be balanced and fair.

  So elders are told to ONLY give counsel to emotionally troubled witnesses from the WT publications ? How does THAT help the troubled person ?

  They are only WT-publication trained. So they should not try to go beyond the scope of their training. The flaw is in their not really encouraging professional help for members.

  So according to this book he is NOT allowed to recommend a therapist who might have helped him ?

  That's gotta be from the law dept. If you recommend someone and something happens, they might sue WTS. Still, it's just paranoid and stupid. They should be able to really assist a member to find proper help, including personal recommendations. Let Jehovah protect the organization. Even short of Jehovah protecting it, courts would recognize the "Good Samaratan" aspect of helping a member by recommending or locating a professional, and they should be covered.

  The WT society rears it's ugly head in being a paranoid mind control cult by DISSING JW members who may reveal confidential matters to a psychiatrist about OTHER JW's. What does the WT society have to hide ?

  Of course that whole idea is stupid paranoia. People that go to professionals do talk about their co-worker, their family, the people they serve side-by-side with (like other JW's). The confidentiality resides in the professional. I mean the way this is written, if you want to discuss a problem about your spouse or your parent or your sibling, it is highly likely that you will reveal that they did something you consider immoral if not illegal. That's what is discussed. If it is criminal and likely to cause actual hurt to people, then the professional has to turn over information that will start an investigation. That's more than the JW elders will do, so it's a good thing.

  But most stuff is benign and never leaves the room. C'mon WTS. Get your heads outta your asses.
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  designs

  The Society thought most psychiatric therapy was ala Esalen with naked bodies in hot tubs and sitting cheek to cheek.

  ...say, not a bad idea
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  LV101

  know of a couple of churches that have clinical psychologists onboard to help their members. oh, that's right, w/tower doesn't have professionals as members (well, very few) or any referral assistance other than advise re/financial aid so they'll have free time to sell magazines to advance themselves inside the hall.

  LV101
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  bottleofwater

  Or even in other issues.

  Instead of getting people counseling for those who are of queer sexualities, here is their dangerous and unhelpful advice (not in that order):

  1. Don't do anything.
  2. We are right, they are wrong. So don't get counseling, only read the five articles about it that just either tell you it's your fault, your parents' fault, and hang in there until you die. Include inaccurate statistics and statements that don't rely on real facts and figures.
  3. You were lying because you didn't tell your parents earlier and you should've because that was important.
  4. Get married.
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  Scully

  flipper:

  Let's break this down. So elders are told to ONLY give counsel to emotionally troubled witnesses from the WT publications? How does THAT help the troubled person?

  In some respects this is a very appropriate thing to do. Elders™' area of expertise is WT publications and (apparently) offering spiritual guidance. I wouldn't want them to be giving me advice regarding psychological counselling, or any other crunchy granola kind of treatment for depression. The reasoning must be - from a purely legal standpoint - that Elders™ should offer counsel that does not go beyond their "scope of practice". They are not medically trained (usually) and could be - in a situation that went badly as a result - accused of "practicing medicine without a licence" if they offered medical advice, particularly medical advice in matters of mental health. Their area of expertise is the Bible and WT publications, and if the troubled person asks them to offer encouragement or help to cheer them up, that is within their scope of practice.

  What if the individual NEEDS professional therapy or counseling from a liscenced psychiatrist?

  There's nothing there that prevents an Elder™, or any member of a JW Congregation™ from saying/asking: "I'm really concerned about you and your well-being. Is this something your family doctor is helping you with?" / "Do you need a support person to accompany you to your doctor's visits?" Those are actually practical suggestions that direct the individual to appropriate services, without imposing personal opinion or offering quasi-medical / alternative treatments that may cause more harm than good.

  Here is another angle to consider: What if a emotionally troubled ELDER has had to go to a professional therapist for counseling for depression and received help & benefits by such counseling? So according to this book he is NOT allowed to recommend a therapist who might have helped him? That is the message given by this information.

  I think this is actually another Legal Department™ recommendation. Remember the hierarchy and the "power" differential between an Elder™ and the average JW Publisher™. Even when you are associating together as peers and just "shooting the breeze", the boundaries between "friends" and "clergy/ congregation member" can become very easily blurred. It's the same reason why doctors and nurses are cautioned against having friends and family members as patients. Again, there's nothing written there that would prevent any congregation member from suggesting the person seek appropriate referrals from their own physician.

  Personally, I'd be inclined to think that Elders™ would want to refrain from disclosing to the average JW Publisher™ the fact that they were under the care of a psychiatrist or psychologist, at all costs. After all, they are the ones expected to set the example for all to see of how they are part of The Happiest People on Earth™.

  An elder is ONLY allowed to give WT society publications information to counsel a depressed Jehovah's Witness. This is dangerous. The WT society is messing with people's lives and mental health. Is it any wonder so many witnesses remain in a depressed state?

  I would think it to be even MORE dangerous for them to offer medical advice without a licence. As long as there is an understanding between the Elder(s)™ and the congregation member that their role is to provide spiritual guidance, spiritual encouragement, and NOT to influence the individual's personal choice in seeking medical attention, they are operating within their scope of practice.

  I know from personal experience the effects of JWs trying to dissuade me from seeking medical attention when I really needed it - with specific instructions "Don't tell the shrink you're a Witness or he'll think we're all crazy" (notice the negative connotations in that one sentence: "shrink" = pejorative; "he'll think we're all crazy" = "you're crazy") - so I'm thinking that any directives from the Mother-Ship that basically instructs Elders™ to (a) operate within their scope of practice/expertise, (b) not to attempt to negatively influence an individual's choice to seek medical attention, are good ones.
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  flipper

  Thanks for the replies. Good points you bring out.

  OTWO- Good points you bring out. I agree with you that the WT society is watching their legal behind in telling elders NOT to recommend any particular psychiatrist to members. Your statement, " If it is criminal and likely to cause actual hurt to people, then the professional has to turn over information that will start an investigation . " And THAT STATEMENT in my opinion is why the WT society gives this directive to the elders. They are all about information CONTROL. And they are all about OUTWARD appearance. It's HOW they appear to people on the outside that's important- not actually the REALITY of what's going on inside the cult that's important. And to me- I feel that's the most dangerous part of all about the WT society.

  DESIGNS- " Naked bodies in hot tubs and sitting cheek to cheek. " Yeah, a pretty nice scenario you paint there. What could the WT society POSSIBLY find wrong with THAT ? LOL !

  LV 101- That WOULD be a good idea if the WT society had some clinical trained psychologists on board to offer professional advice to depressed people. However the WT society emphasizes their OWN publications so much - I find it difficult to believe they would ever give ANY validity to a " worldly trained " psychologist or psychiatrist , whether they were a JW or not.

  BOTTLEOFWATER- Exactly. WT society will ALWAYS emphasize their own publications & articles first- even if it is loaded with BS information which would do further damage to depressed people. They are so arrogant - they can't or won't admit that witnesses could actually be assisted in a positive way by professional therapists
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  baltar447

  LOL, this is too funny. I was talking with a couple elders one time and they both were on anti depressants. Need a shrink for that script I think?

  One elder really helped someone close to me with his marriage by recommending a therapist for his wife, probably saved his marriage as his wife was really depressed and had issues. I guess with this new edict on that situation now he'd be sol since that elder would get into trouble for recommending it.
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  baltar447

  Sorry, it's not funny. People's lives can be ruined by idiotic policies.

  Perhaps the pharisees had an edict of not helping someone that was beaten up by the side of the road, Probably a rule they made so they wouldn't been seen around the man to avoid the appearance of something improper.
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  Palimpsest

  I am really, really, REALLY happy to see them banning elders from recommending therapists. There was a pretty legendary JW psychologist in my area who became the go-to guy for elders who wanted to make suggestions. Elders were basically funneling patients to that guy, giving him a nice steady income. Making matters worse, since this guy was a JW himself, he only gave "Scripturally-based" therapy, AND he would rat people out to their elders if they admitted to any wrongdoing. He broke pretty much every ethical standard in the book, but no one dared go up against him -- after all, you can't get your fellow JW in trouble with the state licensing board. So as far as I'm concerned, this is terrific news. That may very well be the only situation like this that's ever happened with JWs, since they discourage psychology so much, but if it happened once, it's good to know it's banned from happening again.

  If anyone is from Connecticut, by the way, you might remember him...I won't give his full name, since he died a few years ago and I don't want to drag his name through that, but he was based in New Britain and people used to drive from all over the state to go see him. I remember going to appointments at his office with my mother when she was going through his half-assed "grief counseling," and it was the weirdest place ever...it was located in a converted home, across from a roller skating rink (if I remember correctly), and the waiting room had WT magazines instead of regular ones. And his office didn't have windows. I remember it always creeping me out for some reason.