John Walker

by mike047 61 Replies latest jw friends

  • Abaddon
    Abaddon

    Richard Murray; if he's a decent Muslim he'll not have hair on his scrotum; they practise depliation. Thought you might be interested.

    Jan H; no, no, don't be reasonable!! I mean, someone might find out that maybe he was brain-washed at one of the Taliban training camps, having gone there as perhaps as a new, and/or moderate Muslim who'd had the wool pulled over his eyes, and then indoctirnated once he was isolated.

    After all, all of us KNOW it's impossible to make someone believe crap, people only do bad things because they are bad.

    Those JW's and Moonies and Muslims, they should shoot them ALL for beliving that stuff, get it over and done with, as it's their own fault isn't it? R

    eligious ignorance has NEVER made do something stupid, it's an excuse bad people use. Besides, we want someone to blame, and we nearly got that Omaha guy's execution on TV, we might get this guy fried on prime time!! And let's not even bother to pretend to have a fair trial; he's been tried and convicted in the court of public opinion already, that's good enough.

    I find it quite funny when x-cultists ignore the fact that other people might be religously indoctrinated too.

    Seriously, if the guy is guilty, then let him go to jail for as long as his crimes warrant. But a fair trial is paramount, otherwise we do as they do.

    People living in glass paradigms shouldn't throw stones...

  • Utopian Reformist
    Utopian Reformist

    One thing is certain, the administration will manipulate and extract as much political advantage as possible from this whole affair.

    I think agendas have already sprung everywhere in government, in media coverage, and later on JWL will be approached by publishers for a book or novel, maybe a movie on DVD by next year?

  • ashitaka
    ashitaka

    I truly feel sorry for this yuppie rich kid who was hanging out with the Taliban. Really, I do. If he was with a gang on a Los Angelas Street, and they killed a couple of people, and he was with them when they were arrested, incarcerated, still with them when they tried to break out, I wouldn't convict him.....really.

    All nambi-pambi liberals need to shut up.

    ashi

  • SusanHere
    SusanHere

    SEEKER --

    You called this a "nonwar"? Sorry, but Americans died in attacks by a foreign entity. That's a war. My SON is over there. That's a war. My husband and two other sons are involved in the defense over here. That's a war. Americans are dying. That's a war.

    Get a clue, Seeker. This is real.

    Susan

  • Seeker
    Seeker
    You called this a "nonwar"?

    Because Congress has not yet declared war, and the constitution says that until that happens there is no war. Presidents don't get to declare war.

    Your son is in a noble effort to fight terrorism. Good for him. But his "war" on terrorism is like the "war" on drugs. Not the same as a constitutionally-sanctioned war.

    Is that enough of a "clue" for you? I'm talking abour real facts, not media-induced propaganda.

  • Utopiano Reformato
    Utopiano Reformato

    Today, I tend to agree with SEEKER. This sensationalized media police action is not exactly a "complete" war.

    Because terrorists spring from many places, the coalitions/UN cannot wage conventional war against any particular nation. They are forced to resort to unconventional means.

    I know that many people have relatives and friends serving overseas during this situation. It is painful, stressful, emotional and fearful. It is hard to simply let the voices of patriotism and rally cries for freedom and America take over your heart and make you feel good when you are not certain of the condition of someone you know far away.

    Perhaps, engaging in debates allows for an outlet and venting of frustrations, this too is temporary. I don't have a magical answer. only that I hope the amount of suffering is reduced as much as possible wherever this thing goes.

  • Seeker
    Seeker

    Here's a scenario under which Walker's guilt is less than death-worthy. Does it fit the known facts? Seems to as far as I've heard. If you've heard otherwise, please chime in.

    Remember that the Taliban have only been our "enemy" since about October, and only after they refused to hand over bin Laden as Bush knew they would do (since they were religiously obligated to do so), and thus Bush knew he could paint them as an enemy by making this demand without giving any proof to back his claims. Before October (or very late September), the Taliban were not in the picture other than as yet-another-odious regime in some far-off land. A regime I have been condemning for years (yes, I have heard of them long before 9/11), but not one that wsa an enemy of the U.S.

    Furthermore, Islam didn't have a bad name in the U.S. until post-9/11.

    So now we have young, idealistic Walker who did what so many of us did: he joined a religion different than that of his parents. Ah, rebellious, idealistic youth! Anyway, he's studying Islam from his religious teachers, and grooving to what he was learning. He wants to take it to next step and fight for his beliefs (sounds just like some rabid JW's, doesn't it?), but his religious teachers tell him he's better off as a student, not a fighter.

    Being young, ignorant, and idealistic, he wants to fight for his new cause anyway. So he disappears from his religious teachers and family and heads to Pakistan. Meanwhile, his parents frantically try to find out what has happened to him (nowaytess, here is your answer: I did know they didn't have contact with their son. DId you know they very much wanted contact, but that HE cut it off?). His religious teachers try to figure out what's happened to him. But he disappears.

    Now he's getting Taliban training in Pakistan. Remember, 9/11 hasn't happened yet, and they are not yet our enemy. He is in a far-off land, doing his religious zealout thing as so many of us did, and it has nothing to do with America. After his training, he goes to Afghanistan to fight the Taliban cause, again, having nothing to do with America at this stage.

    Now 9/11 happens. Does new travel well in Afghanistan? Nope. And what you hear is filtered by the Taliban. Do you think Walker got the straight story? Of course he didn't. He got propaganda. He probably hadn't a clue about 9/11 the way it really happened, but believed whatever lies the Taliban told him.

    Still, the bombing begins and he freaks out. After all, this is his own country attacking, and now what does he do? Leave the country? He hears that any Taliban caught at the border are arrested. Can't do that. He probably sticks to his friends and tries to dodge bombs.

    Then he is captured. When the news of his capture first hit, there was some confusion about him and who he was and what he was doing when he was caught. The stories of his fighting came out later on. Who knows what he was actually doing? Maybe he was just dodging bombs and trying to stay alive, still unsure what the Americans were doing to his new friends, and still clueless to the big picture of terrorism.

    So he's captured, and interviewed, and still unsure of all the events going on he gives a witness about his faith, just like we would have done once upon a time, all us ex-idealistic Witnesses when confronted with the facts for the first time. Now he arrives in America, a prisoner, and he hears the entire story. Think he's having second thoughts about his choice now? Just like we did when we learned the truth about the WTS?

    Did he fight against America? Or was he just in the wrong place at the wrong time? None of us know yet. Perhaps at the trial we will learn. Until then, calling for his death may be premature. Time will tell.

  • GWEEDO
    GWEEDO
    HI,GWEEDO, I am not familiar with David Hicks, can you provide me with some information on him?

    G'day Mike. Hicks is a 20-odd yr old caught fighting in Afghanistan. He joined the Taliban just like Walker. He's from Austrailia...you know Australia, that's the country that first pledged allegiance to the US cause and said it would give anything Bush needed, including our Special forces guys when requested. So anyway, the US wont confirm this, they wont confirm anything in fact, but he's apparently being held at camp X-ray. Actually I think it might be confirmed that he is now? But he is in US custody. Apparently he is going to interviewed in the next few days...and then interrogated, thats what was reported in the papers down here. When certain Australians asked if he had been afforded his right to lawyer the US responded that it would 'not be appropriate at this time'. Geezz??? that means that when the trial comes and WHEN the US ships him back here, all those interviews will be inadmissable in court I suppose? But then again maybe he was offered his lawyer and duly rejected the offer, even signing a piece of paper to that effect, just like Walker(doubt it). If the US doesn't ship him back here then the lawyers hired by his parents want a civil trial in the US because this Military tribunal that the US wants to set up apparently has a different standard of proof than normal trials. So I suppose his interview and interrogation without being given the right to a lawyer will be admissable evidence within those walls?

  • ISP
    ISP

    Wait I heard he is getting Johnny Cochrane, and Barry Scheck to defend him. In the end you will find he was at home all the time.

    ISP

  • JT
    JT

    Oops, I'm sorry I thought this thread was about my fraternity hazing in college.

    __________

    this is one SICK DUDE

    but i love it

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