New elders' manual - a few more details

by sir82 65 Replies latest jw friends

  • agonus

    "Loose conduct" = usually "porneia", the term carries sexual connotations.

    "Brazen conduct" = whatever the hell they want it to mean. In this case, probably anything remotely "apostate".

    So the evils of independent thinking have finally trumped the evils of sex, which 99% of dubs are supposedly DFed for.

    I don't think it's going to be too far down the line when we're told that 99% of dubs are now being DFed for apostasy.

    They will continue DFing themselves into oblivion. Good.

  • LostGeneration

    This will be an incredible new tool for the elders.

    Johnny went to a birthday party......How BRAZEN, he knows that is wrong.

    Johnny brought in outside research into his comments last Sunday...How BRAZEN! The slave provides all you need.

    Johnny went on date with a worldly BRAZEN... he should be looking for a JW to marry.

    Johnny is growing a BRAZEN, he knows that represents the hippie rebellion.

    Johnny didn't turn in any time last BRAZEN for him not to report to the elder his performance

    The grip tightens.....

  • AndersonsInfo

    This is a very interesting thread. Generally, I'm in agreement with CuriousButterfly and others who expressed a similar sentiment about the word "brazen."

    Brazen to me is more of a "catch all" phrase where the BOE can use it with impunity as to where they see fit. It can cover sexual issues to something where someone is "too boldor shameless" in their thoughts/actions. Personally this will cause huge problems because this will give the BOE more supposed "power".

    Instead of “Causing Divisions,” if I were to be disfellowshipped today for my past “apostate” conduct, I bet “brazen conduct” would be the reason because according to the definition of the word “brazen,” and other words associated with “brazen” (see below), that one word could just about fit any conduct that was not approved by our “clever” and "loving" Service Department "brothers." The word “loose” conduct conveyed the thought that one lacked moral restraint, but “brazen” has a far broader meaning and soon will probably be the catch-all reason for disfellowshipping. And “brazen" conduct sounds so much more menacing and alarming.


    Internet dictionary: shameless or impudent: brazen presumption.

    Webster’s Dictionary—Marked by contemptuous boldness


    Webster’s Thesaurus: Brazen—1 syn INSOLENT. 2, audacious, bold
    2 syn SHAMELESS, arrant, barefaced, blatant, brassy, brazenfaced, impudent, overbold, unabashed, unblushing, brash

    INSOLENT : Dictionary—Insultingly contemptuous in speech or conduct. 2. Exhibiting boldness or effrontery: IMPUDENT

    IMPUDENT: Dictionary—1 Lacking modesty. 2 marked by contemptuous or cocky boldness or disregard of others.

  • chickpea

    i am guessing the PFLAG decal on my vehicle
    is brazen enough to finally get me DF'd!!! hah!

  • Essan

    Undercover said: "which to me signifies that they'll now have the means at their disposal to punish, er, I mean counsel, anyone whose attitude they don't like. They no longer have to wait until some actual loose conduct is committed...they can go after anyone who displays a bad attitude or questions authority"

    Yeah, that's how I read it too. In the past they always used the idea that, even if the elders give a suggestion, while technically you don't HAVE to do what they say, it shows a "bad attitude" to ignore their counsel. Likewise, doing X, Y or Z may not be Scripturally wrong but it may "stumble" some people, so it shows a "bad attitude" to do it anyway. Now, they can use the idea that if you "brazenly" show a "bad attitude" by not doing what you are told or pressured to do then you can be DF'd if the Elders wish.

    It gives a lot more power to the Elders IMO.

  • ziddina

    "Loose" conduct could mean that you were tempted and slipped up...

    "Brazen" conduct could mean that you've been doing research on your own, have found out things about the Watchtower Society that THEY don't want you to know, and you are unrepentant about your new knowledge and that you are being very stiff-necked about returning to your previous state of ignorance...

    Jes' my two cents worth...


  • cattails

    Brazen = not afraid of a false prophet WTS and its Governing Body

    Brazen = not cowering before some good-ol'-boy judicial committee made up of underqualified independent agents.

    Brazen = speaking your mind about the nonsense that the WTS prints and the many doctrinal filp-flops they've made a crucial part of the JW religion dogma.

  • Beware of false prophets
    Beware of false prophets

    I'm sure most of the R&F would say that this is just more of the separating work (if they were ever given enough info to think about it at all). So to them, as with most brazen WTS info (LOL), the end must be oh so near because the work is changing (light getting brighter), which automatically means that they might not make it to the next near milestone of their lives.

    Does anyone else see this as one of those dominoes that moves a bit after you stand it up, threatening to fall and knock down the whole line that you just set up? They will have all the more power to lessen their numbers, divide families, and draw attention to others on their way out. Some of the R&F will become that much more strict about how they (and their children) are, so as to avoid Jah's wrath (or the possibility of the humiliation of being kicked out), and others who are starting to wake up a little might find themselves unable to deal with the pressure to comply on such a strict level. I'm not saying that this will end them, but it will be interesting to see if the number of DF'd spikes and if we see a significant increase in the people in the ex-JW community who have chosen to leave before having to deal with the elders telling them how their unrepentant, brazen behavior is a stumbling block to others and they need to be removed from "Jehovah's Organization".

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  • booby

    I think it was very Brazen of the gb to ignore the established dictionary meanings of generation and come up with their own. But then there is no shortage of brazen conduct from them.

  • VM44

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