The Beginning of the End for Me?

by rem 37 Replies latest jw experiences

  • Valis
    Valis

    dedalus,

    your assumption that I don't understand is far from true. I've had to put up w/JWland all my life and have come to the realization that none of that is worth my time. As well, to string them along and antagonize is, IMHO, a waste of time. I indeed read his post, and I understand why people linger in/around the org. They linger because of family, friends, guilt feelings over leaving, the need for structure, etc...and some linger to be antagonistic, which is the JWs favorite past time. BTW, I don't have the last word on anything, just my angle after a lifetime of family problems with people who know better, but stay anyway.

  • rem
    rem

    Valis,

    When the elder asked me in what way I could call myself an "Agnostic Witness" I replied, "In the same way a Jewish person can be an agnostic or atheist - they are a Jew by culture or race. I'm a Witness by culture, this is how I was raised." I will always have that and I'm not ashamed of it. It has shaped me as a person, and though life isn't always easy, I'm proud of the person I've become and the fact that I was able to see through the Witness propaganda machine. I'm also proud of the fact that I've helped others to see the same thing and they have been able to make their own decisions in this regard. I believe I am being true to myself. I'm very comfortable with where I'm at right now.

    That reminds me of another thing the elder asked. He said, "do you think your questions and doubts have affected you positively or negatively?" Of course he wanted me to say negatively, but instead I said, "Most definitely positively. I am comfortable with my new beliefs and I feel this path is so much more intellectually honest, which is important to me. I feel my wife and I are much happier now, even though most of our so-called friends have dumped us."

    I guess what I'm trying to say is that I'm most definitely not sitting on the fence. I've been a full-blooded apostate for more than a couple years now. But I still do have feelings for friends and family trapped inside. I do still enjoy their company (though the relationships have changed a bit). My hope is that by not being formally DF'd or DA'd I will have more influence over helping them to see both sides of the story and coming to an informed decision than by being no part of their lives as a forgotten DA'd or DF'd family member or former associate. So far my approach has done much good in at least opening some friends and family's eyes and I hope I can continue on this path.

    Also, I probably did not make this clear before, but I have not been to meetings in over a year and have not turned in time for two years. The last meeting I went to was a couple weeks ago and that was just because my brother-in-law was giving his first public talk (it wasn't even my congregation). The people in my congregation probably have forgotten what I look like by now lol. I'm not considered a witness by any of my work associates or "worldy" friends. In fact, most Witnesses in the area know I don't believe in this stuff anymore, but because I'm not DF'd we can still act civil to one another. Just fading away as best we can.

    Dedalus,

    So good to hear from you, man! I did try to be very respectful during the meeting, but I was very nervous. I wasn't trying to be respectful because I feel they have any power over me, it was because I genuinely like these brothers. I've shared many good times with them in the past and I know that they really only want to help me. I think they do miss me.

    They could tell that I am very passionate in my beliefs. I wish I was more calm and collected, but like I said I was totally caught off guard by this visit. I made sure there was common ground on both sides to where we would all feel comfortable agreeing to certain points each of us made. I gave them time to speak their mind without interrupting and they showed me the same courtesy.

    I think what helped me get through it was a realistic expectation from the meeting. I knew that none of us were going to change the other's mind. I just let them know where I'm at and that I appreciate their concern. The only problem I had was my nervousness since I wasn't prepared for a call. I had a sudden attack of aphasia to where I couldn't remember names or bible verses immediately. It was quite annoying. So it didn't go quite as smoothly as I've portrayed it, but I do think I left them with a good impression. I think my approach is what has kept me from being DF'd for all of this time. I have been completely honest with them and they have had more than enough rope to hang me for a couple years now, but they haven't even though elders from my hometown congregation wanted to see serious action against me and were putting pressure on them.

    Mrs. rem and I have discussed it and we are prepared for whatever happens. In some ways being DF’d would make life easier since I wouldn’t have to worry about certain things, but right now I like the fact that witnesses have to make their own decision whether to associate with me or not. I even like how it makes some of them uncomfortable because there is no formal action against me and they don't know what to do. Once I’m DF’d, then the decision is automatically made for them and that is the part that bothers me.

    I suppose I just need to give it more time. I’m trying to do the slow fade, but I’m not doing it slow enough. I guess I’m too impatient. Some day I won’t be considered a Witness anymore and they will just leave me alone, but that day is not here yet.

    rem

    "We all do no end of feeling, and we mistake it for thinking." - Mark Twain
  • Valis
    Valis

    Sorry if I came off irritable rem.

  • rem
    rem

    No worries, Valis!

    rem

    "We all do no end of feeling, and we mistake it for thinking." - Mark Twain
  • SixofNine
    SixofNine

    rem,

    Nome here. I had almost the exact thing happen to me last week. I even thought about using the "agnostic witness" angle (although I did not have that particular lingo thought up). I chose not to, but did let them know that I had no interest in making a formal disassociation.

    It sounds like the tone of our respective conversations was very similar, although my meeting only lasted about 20 minutes. The new, young elder was actually pretty quick to want to get out of there. I think the idea of a JW who isn't too sure about Gods existence was very uncomfortable for him.

    I was feeling pretty sure they might just make an announcement at the next meeting, but that did not happen, so I'm wondering, like you, if this will just blow over.

    Valis,

    I gotta get in on some of those mycology experiments

  • peaceloveharmony
    peaceloveharmony

    rem, just jumping in to let you know i hope the best for you with this shitty situation :):) the best of luck to you and mrs rem.

    love
    harmony

  • rem
    rem

    An update:

    I just got a call from one of my Witness buddies. He was contacted by one of the elders that came to my house last weekend. They asked him questions about me. He's a bit worried that it's all about to go down. He did a bang up job of defending me, but I doubt it will be good enough to get me out of this mess.

    I'll keep you guys posted with any further developments.

    rem

    "We all do no end of feeling, and we mistake it for thinking." - Mark Twain
  • Abaddon
    Abaddon

    rem; all the best with your difficulties. I can understand you wanting to go for the third option; walking away. I was fortunate enough to do it, for family reasons, but even if a different outcome is forced upon you, I amsure light and love will still be with you...

    People living in glass paradigms shouldn't throw stones...

  • out4good3
    out4good3

    That's just one of the reasons I bailed. Got tired of that KGB, Nazi mentality of always tryiing to conforms so as not to stumble or cause anybody concern. Seems when you're in, you're expected to turn into a busybody always into everyone elses affairs.

  • 144thousand_and_one
    144thousand_and_one

    rem,

    I think you posted that stuff on Amazon cuz the real you wants out, sooner rather than later. I hate to be the torchbearer of reality, but the JWs don't keep those that question their authority. Your goose is cooked; no more boring, tortuous meetings and assemblies, no more pressured proselytizing, no more abstention from holidays and birthdays, and no more compulsion to risk your life should a medical need arise.

    Why don't you beat them to the punch and send them a resignation letter? That way, you'll have the satisfaction of controlling an important moment of your life, instead of giving that control to the elders. You're going to need to get used to controlling your own life after you leave. The realization of how much control they've had over your life will be shocking for you, as it's hard to see it when you're an active part of their organization.

    Good luck to you -- we're rooting for you!

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