Former Elders and Friendly Fire

by jst2laws 26 Replies latest jw friends

  • libra_spirit

    There is a Spiritual principle at work here.
    Stated simply "Everything happens for a reason"

    All is the result of great planning and much effort on the astral and inner planes where we are intricatly planning this all out, so as to benefite the most people in the most powerfull ways possible.

    Can you say that anyone should spend thier whole life here and never leave, that would be silly. You may not like why people seem to leave but is it really necessary for everyone to have a loving reason to exit. Sometimes our own obsessions need some devine intervention to put us on another path. Sometimes we need a good kick in the pants to realize we have beaten our head against the wall long enough. Or maybe we have finally done enough for others and the scale is now balanced. Who can say?

    I try to "Give it to Spirit" and accept what people want to do, giving them the total freedom to do that, without assinging blame. Even when fights break out, I try to ask myself "Why do these two need to fight?" Who am I to say it will not bring some greater benefite down the road.

    And lastly "Trust in Spirit to provide the expierences we are ready for next" I wish them well on thier path wherever it may take them next.

    These principles exist in many so called Religions under different names and they are accepted by most Spiritual paths.

    Suck the nectar from the Religions but toss the thorns.

  • gumby

    To six and just2: It's all about the scalps and foreskins baby. You'll understand that one day. []

    Having decided to not even read the negative posts or work of the posters I have failed to consider the posiblity you have proposed. I am open to being convinced if it is that simple"

    Can someone tell me what the poop you two are talking about!

  • SixofNine

    You watch your language mr. Gumby potty mouth!

    Just2, you've depressed me thinking I might be right.

  • LoneWolf

    jst2laws & JT ---

    Sometimes it is discouraging to see the types of things that has happened here lately. I know that for some time after I started posting that I was seriously wondering if I should continue. Finally I came to realize that if we are going to ever get to know other people enough to have a sense of unity, the only way is to have the patience to give them the benefit of the doubt even though it may be necessary to rebuff their aggressions and defend ourselves at times.

    The things that we must aim at as goals is to not interpret disagreements as enmity, and to give tempers enough time to cool down and allow reflection to work. I think that the greatest and truest friends I've ever had were those that I clashed head on with at first. When each found out that the other fought fair, trust set in.

    A word of advice: When someone attacks you for still being in the Organization or being an elder/ex-elder, let it slide off like so much water off a duck's back, yet, don't ignore it. More than likely, that individual is one who has felt helpless at one time or another as to defending themselves from one. Now that they are no longer under that arrangement, the natural human reaction is to go to the other extreme.

    What even they don't realize (and would rather die than admit) is that the strength of such reactions stem from the fear they had at that time and still retain. As much as possible, be gentle, but by no means sacrifice yourself in atonement, for that will merely be interpreted as cowardice. They will come on all the harder then. Fairness includes being fair to oneself.

    Xena --- Amen to that!

    Island Woman & Lilacs --- I for one am glad you spoke up. Those are words of wisdom.

    I've probably seen more than my share of outrageous things done in the congregations, but I too must say that the majority of those in positions of responsibility are themselves doing all they know how and are in their own way victims of the system.

    To all --- I mentioned something about the greatest friends I've ever had above. The reason I treasured them above all others was that even though we disagreed, sometimes vehemently, both would realize that the heat came from sincerity and anxiety for the truth, whatever and where ever it may be. The result was that we would continue in our discussions with both realizing that there was a truth here, and it was probably somewhere in the middle. By continuing, we would pare off the dross layer by layer, and both would gain knowledge. Of course, all would be destroyed if either allowed it to drop to a personal level.


  • LoneWolf

    Gumby --- My interpretation of those cryptic comments are that now that many of these former JW's are out and can express themselves freely, they will gleefully exact vengeance for all that they have suffered before, and the elders, past or present are their targets with no consideration given as to whether those elders took advantage of their position or not.

    And, yes, there are those who want their pound of flesh and care very little as to whom it is taken from. That is why I say above that we must be fair to all, including ourselves.


  • Frenchy

    IslandWoman and Lilacs:
    Thank you very much for your words. Too many, it would seem, are unable or perhaps unwilling to see the other side of the picture. IslandWoman’s husband represents a considerable segment of ‘the elder arrangement’, decent, hardworking, and sincere men who are or were trying to do their best with what they believed to be the truth.

    As for the negative posts I believe that they serve their purpose if they are done in earnest and without the profanity and personal attacks. If an idea has merit it can stand a little resistance.

  • You Know
    You Know

    I thank God that there are such strong-willed individuals at the helm. I would much prefer their tyranny to yours. / You Know

  • jst2laws

    You said: "If we are to blame All the Elders for how some of them act. We might as well blame all the JW's for how a few act.

    We were all brainwashed by this cult. Elders inclueded, and being so were following what we thought was the truth."

    Thats it. It would be nice if we all would relish this reality and congradulate each other for escaping instead of attacking a few for being more reprehensible than ourselves. But I understand, as JT and Lonewolf pointed out many have been seriously hurt by men in control and this requires patience on our part.

    .."More than likely, that individual is one who has felt helpless at one time or another as to defending themselves from one. "

    One of many of your comments I agree with. Thanks for the advise too.


  • NeonMadman
    I thank God that there are such strong-willed individuals at the helm. I would much prefer their tyranny to yours. / You Know

    At least you admit that they are tyrants. We're making progress, YK!!

    "The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

  • teejay

    We're all entitled to our opinion.

    One person sees an argument; the other sees a spirited debate.

    One person sees a joke that makes them laugh; the other (of the same race) sees a racial slur.

    One person sees an organization with Divine backing; another sees a corrupt religious system far removed from God.

    Different strokes for different folks.

    We should be eternally vigilant against attempts to check the expression of opinions that we loathe. -- Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr.

    Fight for your opinions, but do not believe that they contain the whole truth, or the only truth. -- Charles A. Dana

    What we have to do is to be forever curiously testing new opinions and courting new impressions. -- Walter Pater

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