The Probabilty of there being an Intelligent Designer

by cantleave 140 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • VoidEater

    DD: Why do you need tools [to detect that which can kill you]?

    Because our senses are too limited for science. There are animals that see and hear things that exist beyond our direct experience. There are other tangible artifacts that require more delicate tools.

    It is the job of science to explain what is measurable. Human sensory apparatus is not sufficient for that job.

    Indeed, without external mechanisms of some kind, it is very difficult to determine the rate of time passing, and our defintions of segments of time are for the most part arbitrary. Time is not a monolithic, constant, perfectly forming dimension - it is malleable, changing relatively through the simple difference of rate of motion.

    What came before time? There may have been no time at all. None of us were there. We often lack the imagination of an Einstein to form a theory of what that might have been like, it is so far out of our experience.

    My point is that simply because we are not familier with an artifact coming into existence without a designer does not mean a designer must have existed for life. There is no evidence that life was designed, and there is evidence that life forms have evolved.

    We are not generally familiar with time flowing in different ways, but that does not mean that it always flowed at a predictable rate - indeed, the evidence is that time is a relative "dimension".

    From what I have seen, the human psyche becomes very uncomfortable when presented with a paradigm outside of its common experiential context, and therefore insists that things must be the way that reduces anxiety. "There must have been a Creator." "Time must have always flowed."

    It's as if very few people can be satisfied with, "I don't know."

    Science and Religion

  • PSacramento


    You really didn't answer my question...

    So allow me to change it a bit, according to your reply:

    Short answer: no. But we can get answers to things we do not expect

    Ok, so to you believe that we will get answeres to things we don't expect answers too? yes?

  • bohm

    PSacramento: Yes, indeed - what is the nature of consciousness? Is there a grand unified theory of space, time and the fundamental forces? Is there a fundamental reference frame in space? What is dark matter? Are we alone in the universe? Is there a God? Is time travel possible? -- some of these questions can only be answered possitive, but i hope and think many of them will be answered in the next century. Many of these questions will lead to new ones i cannot think of now, and there might be a dark horse like Gödels theorem that will answer a question i didnt even know you could ask, even less actually answer.

    But i very much doubt science will ever be able to answer if red is prettier than green.

  • PSacramento


    I appreciate your "faith" in science.

  • bohm

    PSacramento: Im not sure i understand your definition of faith. Is it 'faith' in medicine to say that AIDS will properly be cureable within the next century? Is it 'faith' in technology to say new high-tc superconductors will be synthezised within the next century which will be more usefull than what we currently have? Is it faith in biology to say that we will properly have a pretty good idea of how the cell works in a century or two?

    I thought faith was connected to the belief in God?

  • PSacramento

    Faith is different things to different people, in your case it seems to be based on the belief that, because you have seen what science can do and has done that you have "faith" it will continue to do and do greater things.

  • besty

    good job Bohm

    watch out for those in a logical corner attempting to to change the question,,,,

  • wobble

    Dear bohm,

    Is God, or if you prefer, the Intelligent Designer , a Mathematician ?

    Or is mathematics another accident ?

    Mathematics seems to underpin our universe, and therefore be very useful, if not vital ,in explaining it.



  • JustHuman14

    I believe there is an inteligent Designer. It would have been too many coincidences to create life by accident. I don't have anything against evolution. Scientists are studying evolution on this planet and they give their results. In no way Science contradicts with faith in God.

    Personally I believe that we are created through a guided evolution process by a Designer. I don't like religious fanatics, like JW's who reject the idea of evolution process. Besides we are talking about facts of evolution that we cannot ignore, and only narrow minded people will argue about evolution.

    So what is the problem if God created life in this vast Universe throug an evolution process???

  • quietlyleaving

    imo "intelligent designer" is appled retrospectively by both creation and evolution (when evolution is seen as a progression)

    If we see both terms as closed paradigms then there isn't much difference between creation and evolution imo. But if we see them as open concepts then they are both rich sources of ideas and meaning. For example creation describes an important part of the process of evolution and evolution (when evolution is seen as a progression) describes another important aspect of the process of evolution from a human perspective. But neither is the be all and end of the process of evolution imo.

    edit: the concept of creation can tell us that we are all gifted but progressive evolution can tell us that only some of us are gifted as things stand today.

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