What is an elder?

by acolytes 39 Replies latest jw friends

  • acolytes

    I have concluded that elders are people who take it as their right to torture any baptised member of the congregation who will not conform to their standards.

    Why do I say this?

    Basically I think they see anyone who does not live up to their standards as a threat in which they risk exposure to fealings they would rather die than face. (The irony they pride themselfs in thinking they are in the "Truth")


  • inbetween

    sorry for you bad experiences, partly the ORG is to blame for putting a sense of self-importance into members, who can calim the "thocratical" career, whule being a "nobody" in rela world.

    Even during my pre-apostate time, I always respected the views and decisions of the brothers, as much as the WTS allowed it of course..and so did some I know personally.

    remember, most elders are just captives of a concept as well....

  • acolytes

    Hi inbetween

    Actually I had a very good experience with all the elders. Only my post was about the fabrication in congregations of elders as superior in spirituality to the rest of the congregation. (Jewhovers Witnesses would cease to function if this was not true)

    The elder must use this power to stand up for the status quo,thus in the most profound sence such men are never rebels but can always be trusted to acquiesce in the estatablished order-

    When I confronted certain elders on an individual basis I discoverd they were happy to teach lies .Even thought it unreasonable of me not to quitely leave. This still makes me very angry.


  • nugget

    In my experience elders seem to fall into two camps. There are those that seek the position due to thwarted ambition these are the dangerous ones. There are others who genuinely believe who shepherd the flock of God with love they trust the organisation implicitly. These ones are sometimes shocked by what they learn or they park everything in the wait on Jehovah file.

    The ambitious superfine apostles have little love for the flock and have the loudest voice.

    It was only when I started psychology and could see the way humans automatically obey those in authority that I understood why good people can be conditioned to behave in an irrational way. It also explains why when a group of people is presented with the same set of information why only a few are prepared to buck the trend. This explains why so many elders see the policy files and why so few are prepared to give up the position and see the truth about the organisation. (see Milgram experiment and Stamford Prison experiment)

    I don't hate all the elders in our congregation most cannot see the rotten core of the cult it is a real shame if their talents could be properly employed who knows what they might have achieved in life.

  • acolytes

    Hi Nuggett

    If you have studied phycology does this make sence?

    Elders live within a lie. They need not accept the lie. It is enough for them to have accepted their life with it and in it. For by this very fact, individuals confirm the system, fulfill the system, make the system, are the system.


  • cameo-d

    What is an Elder? One who serves the god El.



  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    It took my father a long time to make Elder.

    The fact that he couldn't drag his kid into the baptism pool held him back for a while.

    This must have been very frustrating for him. He had been a special pio-sneer where there was no need for a new cult, but on his return from years of Watchtower servitude the local division of the cult saw him as a threat to their positions.

    I don't actually know for sure if he did make Elder. I haven't bothered to ask. He is 80 something years old now.

    The last time I discussed a related subject he denied Watchtower policy.

    This doesn't surprise me at all and there are at least two explanations I can think of. He might have deliberately lied, which he does whenever he is backed into a corner, or he doesn't know and has never made Elder. At his age, not to have made Elder would be a major slur on his character and I sincerely hope that is the case. If he lied, he knows he lied, and he knows I know he lied, and I like it like that. He is the one who has to live with it. As far as I am concerned, if any member of any cult has to knowingly lie to me, I have done my job. I don't need them to acknowledge it.

  • zoiks

    My experience fits Nugget's observations. In the handful of congregations that I was part of, about 25% of the elders seemed to be of the bad type, enjoying a taste of power. Most seemed to be doing their best, were always overworked and exhausted, and likely had a very large "wait on Jehovah" mental file drawer.

  • acolytes

    Hi Blacksheep

    Interesting post-Reminded me of a moving poem by Eva Strittmatter:

    Dont fool yourself:also me and you.

    We were born open to the world.

    Now we keep the doors closed

    to him and her and them.......


  • acolytes

    Hi Zoilks

    75% may have been overworked and exhausted and waiting on Jehover-

    But that 75% was also communicating a lie to the congregation and having an irresistible impulse to acquaint the world with their lies .

    Even those that do know its a lie are in the most profound sence such men that can never be rebels. But can always be trusted to acquiesce in the established order.

    Tell an Elder he is teaching a lie you will discover he is happy to teach lies. I do not believe elders are simply held captive by a concept. To believe that is in my opinion still to be under mind control.


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