How much was Christ's ransom sacrifice? Equal to Adam? (page 4)

Robdar

First, the OT is both of our books, and you can't lay exclusive claim to it. And secondly, Christians don't believe one is superior to the other as they are all one writing. It is all tied together completey intertwined and inseparable. It is just the New Covenant supplanted the Old Covenant.

And from a Jewish perspective you could not be more wrong. You can say it all day, all night, and well into next year and you would still be wrong.

And your last sentence makes your second sentence false. If you do not believe one to be superior to the other, then why did you supplant the other?

supplant

One entry found. Main Entry: sup·plant Pronunciation: \s?- ' plant\ Function: transitive verb Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French supplanter, from Latin supplantare to trip up, cause to stumble, from sub- + planta sole of the foot — more at place Date: 14th century

1: to supersede (another) especially by force or treachery
2 a (1)obsolete:uproot(2): to eradicate and supply a substitute for <efforts to supplant the vernacular> b : to take the place of and serve as a substitute for especially by reason of superior excellence or power

synonyms see replace

jonathan dough

Everything in the universe was created by G-d and only by G-d.

Same with Christianity, though I don' think the Almighty created evil.

Judaism completely rejects the dualistic notion that evil was created by Satan or some other deity.

So God created all the evil in the world? And he is the one who destroyed 6 million Jews?

http://144000.110mb.com/144000/i-6.html#VII

Robdar

And he is the one who destroyed 6 million Jews?

Hitler and his minions are the one who destroyed 6 million Jews. It is called free choice.

All is one. We make the choice to do evil or good. We are the ones responsible. And you will never be free until you realize that.

jonathan dough

"Supplant" in the sense that it was nailed to the cross by Christ's sacrifice. Not by force, but out of love. The Jews blew it, just like they seemed to almost always do so, constantly backsliding and denying the Almighty in deed.

Much of the OT is a litany of condemnation by God of the Jews who were vile in God's eyes century after century. Hence the destruction by Babylon and at other times. He never chose the Jews as his people for anything grand that they did but due to His promise to Abraham. He was stuck with a stiff-necked people. Out with the old, in with the new.

And no, I'm not being anti-semitic. They hold a special place in my heart as a whole.

Robdar

Whatever, dude. It's funny how you like to pick and choose your way through the Hebrew Bible to support your beliefs.

Say what you want about the Jews but remember: the covenant between our God and my people is forever.

jonathan dough

And your last sentence makes your second sentence false. If you do not believe one to be superior to the other, then why did you supplant the other?

No it doesn't. I'm referring to the OT and the NT, not the New and Old Covenants contained and/or referenced in them. Yes, the New Covenant is far superior to the Old Covenant which has proven ineffective. How do Jews view Jeremiah 31:31-34 which talks about the New? What does it mean to them?

Judaism completely rejects the dualistic notion that evil was created by Satan or some other deity.

Are we talking about evil, Satan or that Satan and evil are the same things?

So this quote from Wikipedia is wrong?

According to Judaism, therefore, God created both good and evil for his good purpose: "See, I [God] have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil" (Deuteronomy 30:15, KJV); and "I [God] form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things" (Isaiah 45:7, KJV). ... Unlike Judaism, Christianity teaches that Satan was never created as a bad angel of temptation from the beginning but as a good angel with free will.

jonathan dough

Are you saying that Satan played no role in the holocaust?

RR: He did not.

Do Jews believe that demons can inhabit a person? And take over their lives?

jonathan dough

"The mashiach will be a great political leader descended from King David (Jeremiah 23:5). The mashiach is often referred to as "mashiach ben David" (mashiach, son of David). He will be well-versed in Jewish law, and observant of its commandments (Isaiah 11:2-5). He will be a charismatic leader, inspiring others to follow his example. He will be a great military leader, who will win battles for Israel. He will be a great judge, who makes righteous decisions (Jeremiah 33:15). But above all, he will be a human being, not a god, demi-god or other supernatural being."

This is from Judaism 101 and let me tell you it sends shivers down my spine because it portrays the anti-Christ of the Book of Revelation. Wow! You people are off your rockers!

Robdar

Look Johnathan, I wish I could help you but you are the one responsible for your spiritual life and you have to be the one to find the answers.

I wish you well on your path as you search for the answers to your questions. It is a good thing to ponder.

Have a good night and a good journey.

(((((Jonathan)))))

jonathan dough

We make the choice to do evil or good. We are the ones responsible. And you will never be free until you realize that.

I don't think we disagree on this part. Jesus said to repent. The NT is about choices. Christians have a responsibility to stand up to Satan. Not sure what version of Christianity you are referring to.

http://144000.110mb.com/trinity/index-9.html#47

How much was Christ's ransom sacrifice? Equal to Adam?

supplant

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