Giving *deserving ones* Jehovah’s *undeserved kindness*

by OnTheWayOut 30 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • blondie
    blondie

    The word that the WTS translates "undeserved" is "grace" in other bibles. Notice this condescending response from the WTS.

    *** w56 7/1 p. 415 Questions From Readers ***

    ? Is not the NewWorldTranslationoftheChristianGreekScriptures verbose, for instance, in using "catches sight of" for "sees" at 1 John 5:16 and "undeserved kindness" for "grace"?—J. S., United States.

    You do not state whether you have studied the koiné Greek of the Bible or not, but, if not, then, because of your unfamiliarity therewith, the way the New World Translation Committee renders some Greek verbs and terms and expressions in English may seem strained to you or verbose. But not so according to one acquainted with the Greek. The Greek verb rendered "catches sight of" in the NewWorldTranslation is in a peculiar tense of the Greek language, the aorist, and refers not to a repetition of acts or to a continuing action but to just one instance of the act. The use of the present tense of the verb "see," namely, "sees," as in the KingJamesVersion, does not bring out accurately the singular meaning of the verb here in the aorist tense, the catching of a person, as you say, red-handed, in the act.

    Likewise with the expression "undeserved kindness." It is simply because people do not understand the meaning of this Scriptural Greek word in its several uses that the New World Translation Committee made the meaning unmistakable by the use of the above expression. In English the word "grace" has fourteen or more different meanings. Which one does it mean, as at John 1:14 (AV), "full of grace and truth"? Does it mean there "gracefulness"? Or "favor"? Or "the grant of temporary immunity"? Or what? The NewWorldTranslation leaves no doubt as to the meaning but renders it "undeserved kindness," in keeping with the context, as, for instance, the succeeding verse 17.

    So we appreciate the NewWorldTranslation for its attention to detail and its sincere effort to bring out the exact shade of meaning of the original koiné Greek rather than bring out a slipshod translation with an equivocal meaning.

    Their probable souce of this thinking:

    *** it-2 p. 155 Kindness **

    *Joseph H. Thayer in his lexicon says: "The word [kha´ris] contains the idea of kindnesswhichbestowsupononewhathehasnotdeserved . . . the N. T. writers use [kha´ris] pre-eminently of that kindness by which God bestows favors even upon the ill-deserving, and grants to sinners the pardon of their offences, and bids them accept of eternal salvation through Christ." (AGreek-EnglishLexiconoftheNewTestament, 1889, p. 666)

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    *** w56 7/1 p. 415 Questions From Readers ***

    ?Can you please toot your own horn and brag on Fred Franz' supposed mastery of the ancient Greek language, while at the same time, insult the actual genuine thinker who reads your magazine?—GB., United States.

  • babygirl30
    babygirl30

    There was a talk the C.O. gave about 3yrs ago about the difference between "undeserved kindness" and "mercy" ... don't remember the specifics any longer, but I DO recall that he tried to break it down and explain that they are NOT the same?

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    Great vid!

    Agreed, such a crazy statement, a complete oxymoron.

    Agreed also that the JW knows zilch about the Grace of Jesus. They haven't taken His free gift of salvation. Their vain hope is they will be saved by association with the 144 000 as the WT teach, what lies :(

    John 1:17 (New International Version)

    17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.

    The WT has been around for millennia in various guises, same problems in the first century

    Acts 15:10-11 (New International Version)

    10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are."

    Jude 1:4 (New International Version)

    4 For certain men whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.

    As the bible says on several occasions

    2 Thessalonians 3:18 (New International Version)

    18 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all.

    Amen!

    Blessings,

    Stephen

  • Butterflyleia85
    Butterflyleia85

    good post topic! and yes he does OnTheWayOut!

  • snowbird
    snowbird

    http://www.wordinfo.info/words/index/info/view_unit/4287/

    The Greek word kharis/charis - translated grace - is also the root for charity and charisma.

    I wonder why Franz failed to mention that?

    Sylvia

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    I wonder why Franz failed to mention that?

    Simply, the WT don't want the JW coming anywhere near Grace, a free gift that just needs accepting.

    They want them bound to the WT "works", preaching, meetings etc.

    Blessings,

    Stephen

  • undercover
    undercover
    Simply, the WT don't want the JW coming anywhere near Grace, a free gift that just needs accepting.
    They want them bound to the WT "works", preaching, meetings etc.

    Exactly.

    To me, using the word 'undeserved' gives a negative connotation whereas 'grace' is positive. Tying this back to Stephen's comment; in essence the Society is saying, God gives what you don't deserve, so you should do everything possible to show God that appreciate it...and we know just how you can do it.

  • snowbird
    snowbird

    {God gives what you don't deserve, so you should do everything possible to show God that appreciate it...and we know just how you can do it.}

    The insidious, arrogant, manipulative bastards!

    What took me so long to see this?

    Sylvia

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    Grace is a gift from God, it is not an "undeserved" kindness, it is kindness given to Us without us neededing to "work for it", but we still have to receive it.

    Grace is God's way of telling us that, through Jesus, we have salvation based on our faith in Jesus and NOT based on doing good deeds or works WITH the notion of RECOMPENSE for those deeds.

    We do good out of love not out of our selfish desire for salvation because that salvation is based on Faith and not works.

    Do we NOT do good deeds? of course not, that is not the issue, the issue is WHY we do those god deeds and because of God's Grace through Jesus, those deeds are done out of LOVE and NOT recompense.

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