My life changing dilemma

by teel 24 Replies latest jw experiences

• 

  Tea drinker

  Hello Teel.

  Your situation is similar to what mine was about seven years ago, the difference being that I was the Witness. I met a great girl: very intelligent with a real desire for knowledge on almost any subject. I got her to agree to a "Bible study" with me and even got her attending meetings for a few months but I could see that it was killing her spirit.

  We had fallen in love by that time and planned to marry in the future but whenever she expressed doubts about the religion we would argue and as I had the stronger character she usually relented. I had told her that I would marry her whether she joined the Witnesses or not but I found that I just could not stop trying to convert her. Wing Comander is absolutely right: she is trying to manipulate you and I should know because I did it myself (much to my shame).

  It still brings tears to my eyes when I see her face in my mind and I remember her telling me how she could not understand how I could go from being so tender, romantic and loving to being so angry and unreasonable whenever she would say that she could not accept my religion. It was crazy; I knew I was damaging our relationship but I just could not help myself...afetr all, I thought that I was aiding her in her salvation.

  There were other factors (one particularly large one outside of our control) involved but my constant preaching and resentment crushed our love and I never heard from her again.

  Ultimately Teel you have to be true to yourself and not let your spirit be crushed by someone else. She probably loves you as I loved my darling but from what you are describing the organisation has a hold on her like it did on me. I am no psychologist but I suspect that her loyalty to the organisation will poison your relationship and will likely cause a great deal of pain to both of you. Difficult though it may be for you to see now, clouds often have a silver lining and in my case I was able to begin questioning the organisation a lot more after my heartbreak and now I find myself mentally free and in the process of fading. Who knows? This may be one of the stages of her own exit.

  I hope this gives a little food for thought and will enable you to get a glimplse into "the other" mindset (she is possibly experiencing a dreadful clash within herself, as I did, so a lot of patience and love will be needed if you plan to try and work things out). What you do is ultimately up to you and I hope that you can salvage things. I will pray for you.

  Sorry for the long post.
• 

  teel

  Thanks OnTheWayOut, I like your advice. Although I respect the oppinion to cut loose, I don't feel the strength to do that and I do still love her. There's almost not a day pass by that I don't wish to have wisened up back then before it was too late.

  I have ordered Combatting Cult Mind Control from Amazon, I read lots of good things about it. The second book was not on stock, so I ordered Brainwashing: The Science of Thought Control from Kathleen Taylor. I think she might agree to counseling, she already visited a psychologist a while ago on her own. I'm really glad that there are people out there happily married (happier then we were) to a JW. It gives me hope that it can be done. Thanks.

  Edit: that's great experience TeaDrinker (I mean it helps me, sorry, it must have been bad for you). I think she's feeling the tearing too, that's why she's so judgemental of me, she sees me as the problem of her inner turmoil, which in part is true, if I were to let myself be totally controled she would escape from the pain. Alas as much as I love her, it just doesn't work that way.
• 

  WTWizard

  It is better to insist on discussions, on a rational basis, regardless of what turns out to be the truth. Being objective and honest if you find a discrepancy between what the Washtowel says and what the Bible says, what one Washtowel says and what another Washtowel says, or what the washtowel says and what they do, it is fair game. An occasional minor discrepancy is acceptable, especially if open discussion is allowed. However, if every other word is in disagreement and they are closed minded about it, something is wrong.

  Once a month might not be enough to discuss these irregularities. Every time you come back from a boasting session, you are going to find irregularities. They take scriptures out of context. Read Blondie's comments about the washtowel studies, and Lukewarm's comments about the "Bible" study. You will find that just about every paragraph has some irregularities, and there will be other quotes proving that they are going against what they themselves have said (and often quite recently). Sometimes they are minor issues ("Christians=only JW"). Sometimes, you will see the organization or Jehovah mentioned, but where's Jesus. (For a Christian religion, Jesus is supposed to be the key player.) Other times, it will be something blatant that is not found in the Bible at all.

  Remember, the Bible says that by the fruitages you shall know that this is the truth (and the Washtowel claims to go by the Bible, whether it lies or not). What happens when you see fruitages like intolerance to alternate viewpoints, wasting all one's time and resources in the religion to the point of hardship, and everything you do being what you are told to? And, when you see everything you do being what you are told to on a widespread basis, you have the root cause for many other problems. This leads to excessive drinking, sexual excesses (that is, sex that is fulfilling the need to break free of stagnation, not a natural sex drive), fights, backstabbing, envy, and even physical fights at times. Often, you see children being beaten and threatened for such horrible crimes as fidgeting at a 2-hour boasting session. Is this the sort of fruitage that leads one to believe that this is the truth?

  If not, then it is time to look elsewhere. And, if your partner will not respond in kind, you might have to accept the loss. Usually, this will result in a separation for "absolute spiritual endangerment". However, this kind of separation comes with a price: If you do not commit adultery during this time, there is no basis for remarriage. Sooner or later, your partner will have to come to you and reconcile a rational discussion about whether the religion is worth staying in or not, or end up staying celibate (or get disfellowshipped). At that point, you will have the upper hand to insist on rational discussion about the cancer, whenever the problems happen.
• 

  Chalam

  Read Blondie's comments about the washtowel studies, and Lukewarm's comments about the "Bible" study. You will find that just about every paragraph has some irregularities, and there will be other quotes proving that they are going against what they themselves have said (and often quite recently). Sometimes they are minor issues ("Christians=only JW"). Sometimes, you will see the organization or Jehovah mentioned, but where's Jesus. (For a Christian religion, Jesus is supposed to be the key player.)

  Agreed! The biggest gripe is the WT and how they view Jesus, her is the cornerstone and the capstone according to the bible but clearly not for JWs.

  Also, as WTW has pointed out, the fruit from being a JW is not good. The apples appear good to eat but they taste bitter and are ridden with maggots. There are many people with bad guts and sickness from listening to the WT week in, week out.

  Ultimately, the happiness the WT promise is far off on "paradise earth". It is not the life Jesus promises right here, right now.

  John 10:10 (New International Version)

  10 The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full.

  All the best,

  Stephen
• 

  yknot

  Marriage counselors can be a blessing in pointing out from a mediation position that she is being unfair in her attempted negotiations. They also can help both of you to focus on 'middle ground' versus falling into whose right, whose wrong trap.

  And if the marriage should fail then at least both of you have the counselor to aid you in the final breakup.

  In the mean time you should really consider reaching out for a normal life in the normal world by associating more with worldlies or perhaps consider renewing your old church membership.
• 

  nelly136

  if shes already been put on reproof for leaving a husband due to domestic abuse she will probably be twice as careful not to put a foot wrong with the elders a second time. have you considered going to anger management/counselling in order to prepare yourself for any frustrations that may be caused by getting back together?
• 

  cortiz

  What kind of advice this web site gives!!! i can't BELIVED . i am new here but now i regret .i know the jws for long time and there's a big difference in their organization, to bad people only look the bad things of other people ,but not what's inside , ONLY GOD KNOWS. I WAS RAISED BY MY UNCLE AND AUNT, HE WAS A REALLY VIOLENT PERSON HE TREATED US LIKE WE WERE NOTHING, TO MAKE IT WORSE HIS MOM WORKED WITH SPIRTISM AND BAD THINGS BEGAN TO HAPPEN.MY AUNT AND I PASS TROUGH A LOT DIFICULT TIMES WITH HIM . UNTIL MY AUNT STARTED TO STUDY THE BIBLE AND YEARS LATER GOT BAPTIZED , THINGS WERE GETTING WORSE WITH HIM, BUT NOT BECAUSE OF THE JWS .WE CONTINUED WITH THE BIBLE STUDY AND WE RECEIVED A LOT OF HELP FROM THEM,(1 COR:7:12-16) MY AUNT NEVER LEFT HIM ,BECAUSE SHE KNEW THAT NOBODY IS PERFECT,AND WHAT SHE LEARN FROM THE BIBLE,ALTHOUGH THE JWS TRIED TO TALK TO HIM HE REFUSED TO TALK,WE CONTINUED GOING TO THE MEETINGS AND PREACHING,BUT IT WAS NOT EASY WITH HIM.YEARS PASSED AND I SAW A CHANGE ON HIM . HE STARTED TO BE MORE OPEN WITH US .NO MATTER WHAT, WE NEVER UNRESPECT HIM. MY AUNT WAS A GREAT EXAMPLE TO ME. BY 1984 HE WAS DIAGNOSED WITH: NEUROACANTOSITOSYS,IF YOU WANT IMFO ABOUT IT, LOOK IN THE INTERNET.IN 1990 HE ACCEPT TO STUDY THE BIBLE ,1992 GOT BAPTIZED. TODAY HE'S LAYING ON BED, HE CANNOT WALK ,HE CANNOT EAT NORMAL ,HE CANNOT TALK, HE SUFFER FOR INVOLUNTARY MOVEMENTS, BY THE AGE OF 40S HE HAD ALL OF HIS TEEH REMOVED BECAUSE HE STARTED BITTING HIS LIPS, MY AUNT HAD TO QUIT HER JOB TO TAKE CARE OF HIM.IN OTHER WORDS THE BIBLE IS REALLY POWERFULL (HEB:4:12)AND THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IS HAVING FAITH TO THE THE ONE WHO IS GIVING US THE OPPORTUNITY TO FOLLOW HIM AND LIVE(JOHN3:16) (1 TIM2:3-4)(JOHN17:3). SO PLEASE DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME ON THIS KIND OF WEB SITES THAT'S WHAT SATAN WANT'S. REMEMEBER WHAT HAPPEND ON NOAH"S DAYS.LOOK HELP FROM THE BIBLE AND NOT FROM OTHER PERSON THAN THE ONE WHO GAVE YOU YOUR LIVE.---YOU'LL SEE.SOONER OR LATER.
• 

  bohm

  about cortiz, etc.: is it me, or has there been a serious influx of Crazy TM recently?
• 

  OnTheWayOut

  Cortiz, your story is anecdotal evidence (a story) that, to you, points to sticking with Jehovah's Witnesses. I wish you well with that, but will offer this to you. Your aunt suffered through something that she could suffer through. If a child were being molested in a similar way, I would be disgusted with the idea to suffer through it in hopes of changing the abusive relative. Your aunt was an adult, so she stuck it out. I don't know how much pressure the elders had to apply to her to make her stick it out, or if it was her own decision. Either way, she ultimately decided, so hat's off to her.

  I cannot fault the woman who, in the exact same circumstances, decides not to tolerate such abuse. Regardless of his reason (medical in this case), she doesn't have to put up with it. If he were diagnosed earlier because he was trying to get help, she would have endured less violence. Why does "Jehovah" not have his spirit move the man to see a doctor? I mean, Jehovah is going to draw the man into the organization later, so He could easily have moved him to get diagnosed and stop beating his wife. So, I view this as NO JEHOVAH MOVING HIM TO DO THE RIGHT THING.

  There is more than one way to look at anecdotal evidence.

  Also, some kind of counseling could have done wonders for him, or perhaps her. He may have stopped beating her or she may have gotten the strength to leave a wife-beater. Jehovah could at least have moved his faithful servant to receive the right kind of counseling from the elders to stop tolerating such violence, but no.
• 

  Satanus

  cortiz

  From the situations in which some people find themselves, the wt cult is an improvement. You need it, so stick w it. However, most people do better in freedom from the wt religion. Why don't you start your own thread?

  S