Universal Health Care, Pluses and Minuses (page 20)

Robdar

How in the world did I miss this?

I'd love some sinnamon on your buns, hun.

Burns, that is the hottest thing anybody has said to me this week and I thank you.

~ I am ready for some serious fornication. ~

beksbks

Free market capitalism is the only moral economic system. Period.

Bullshit! Greed makes it the direct opposite of moral.

BurnTheShips

You are wrong, greedy and lack empathy for anyone. You regurgitate one lie after another trying to block any progress or real discussion.

You don't know me. I tell the truth, as I have on this thread. Please point out a single lie. One. If you cannot, you are the liar, not me.

And I am for progress. There are far fewer than 47 million without health insurance (not care). And you cannot predict my future.

BTS

AllTimeJeff

All other systems rely on the use of force. Coercion, if not initiated to prevent coercion or fraud, is always immoral. Free capitalism is the only purely voluntary economic system. It is also the only organic one.

Yup, we are going to have to agree to disagree on this one.

The problem is that capitalism doesn't have to be the ammoral, exclusionary prototype that keeps things just expensive enough to disenfranchose those that need it, esp where healthcare is concerned.

I am not arguing against capitalism, esp as a vehicle of commerce and business. I don't think everyone should have a Lexus or a Cadillac. There are varying kinds of cars. No one is going to buy the poor a luxery vehicle. Sometimes, you get the generic Mac n Cheese.

But we are equating healthcare as a commodity, not as a basic human right. Healthcare, like education, is NOT a commodity, and as such, should NOT be at the mercy of the captains of industry.

purplesofa

I get what you are saying Burns,

I get more than I could ever pay for on my own.

And I get that some people cannot contribute anything

and I don't think they should be left out of the pool.

When I have gone to get care, even paying cash, which we did for the ten years I was married, with kids even, thankfully we were healthy people, but we still had babies to pay for, hospitol bills etc, I felt like I gained so much more than the money I paid, I was healed, I was getting healthy babies, they were getting shots and vaccines relatively cheaply....we benefitted from all the knowledge and intelligence accumulated by many people.

As far as all the other things that you and six, betsy, beks, doe, etc can discuss it is over my head.

and these problems seem like they will work themselves out in time.

I am sorry I am unable to discuss things with as much knowledge as many of the rest of you.

It's a basic human need that we should attain for all.

Look how much we help people in Africa and other countries

to recieve medical assistance.

You already posted about how someday you would like to see people only die when they choose to die.

And it will take research and development to do this.

But do we sacrifice Helping people now for that kind of advancement?

purps

beksbks

LOL, ok, that was funny Burn!

BurnTheShips

Free capitalism is not exclusionary. It is participatory and voluntary by it's very nature. Give, to get. That is moral.

Your second paragraph betrays a very faulty, paternalistic mindset. You get what you want. You want something else? Get it. It doesn't exist yet? Make it.

Healthcare is a commodity. How is it anything other than a commodity? Food is a commodity. Water is a commodity. Shelter is a commodity. Clothing is a commodity. Without any of these you will die. Without a great many other things, you will be miserable. Do you have a right to these things? You have a right to get them. Life liberty and the pursuit of happiness are not positive rights, they are negative. These are not something to be done for you, these are things that are not to be done to you.

BTS

Priest73

Priest, you mean your company donated those computers? No way in hell do I believe you personally did. Nor do I believe for one instant that you are in the top tax bracket. Really? You make more than 99.9% of Americans??

Yes beks, it was my company. the one that I run. the one that I own. It's a small facet of what I do, and what I am. Is that a problem for you?

Universal Health Care, Pluses and Minuses

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