WHAT IS JW VIEW ON CONITNENTIAL DRIFT?

by badboy 32 Replies latest jw friends

  • ziddina
    ziddina

    Yeesh! At last I've got some more blasted posts available to me... HATE being on a short leash!!!

    "Continental Drift" - yes, as Villalobo and Leolia said, it's now (more correctly) referred to as "Plate Tectonics". I used the term "Continental Drift" in my previous post on BadBoy's "Venus" thread because when I was a JW about 25 years ago, it was at that time predominantly still being referred to as "Continental Drift"

    VM44, that textbook is basically correct, but there is so much more to the story than that simplistic statement... The planet Earth has never, never been totally 'flat', unless you want to consider its fully magmatic original form, before ANY rocks cooled enough out of the planet's fiery beginnings - that's AFTER the planetary matter began to congeal and heat from friction, nuclear reactions (NOT in the firecracker style of man-made explosions...) and other forces that may have generated heat, melted the 'star matter' sufficiently for it to become liquid initially. That would have been the stage, by the way, when the materials that made up the core, mantle (several layers of mantle which I won't go into right now) and crust began to separate. Then, in the initial cooling, continental masses formed as the lighter materials (granitic-type materials) rose to the top of the basaltic materials.

    After that initial cooling, the activity of the Earth's crust must have frequently generated mountain ranges [and oceanic depths] - I'm speaking generally, here - and then erosion wore them down, whereupon the entire mountain-range building process started anew...

    For example, the Rocky Mountain Range(s) currently in existence in the state of Colorado is the THIRD such mountain range(s) to exist in that general location in geologic time... Here is a good site that discusses the three major uplifts in the general area that the present Rocky Mountain ranges exist: http://vulcan.wr.usgs.gov/LivingWith/VolcanicPast/Places/volcanic_past_rocky_mountains.html

    The fact that there are oceanic fossils at the top of Mt. Everest (roughly; the Himalayan peaks have sedimentary deposits comprising part of their rock masses) shows that those rocks were once underwater. If, as BadBoy indicates, one wishes to pretend that there was a global flood and those deposits are supposedly part of "Flood" debris, then the Himalayas were uplifted at a rate of 4,838 feet per year, and that's using a figure of 6,000 years ago for the supposed 'occurence of "Noah's" flood'...

    Just to give you a little perspective, the great earthquake that hit San Francisco in 1906 moved the earth in one 296-mile-long section of earth a range of 8-30 feet. WOW! A whole 30 feet of ground-slippage, yet look at all the damage THAT caused!! Its magnitude was later estimated to be approx. 7.7 to 8.3 on seismic wave estimates, moment-magnitude, and Richter scale.

    Going back to the illustration of Mt. Everest, if one divides the 4,838 feet per year by days, you get an average rate-of-earth-movement of 13 feet approx. per day - that would mean that the earth would have been experiencing at least a 7.7 earthquake DAILY just to 'build' the Himalayas - not to mention the Alps, the Rockies, the Andes, etc, etc.

    Let's talk about the Atlantic Ocean!! The Atlantic is over 4,000 miles wide at its widest point(s). That's equivalent to 21,120,000 feet. Now, let's pretend that the Atlantic ocean began opening at the supposed 'beginning' of the supposed 'Creation' of the earth by a regional Middle Eastern god of a bunch of backward, superstitious, ignorant Middle Eastern nomads... Let's use the WTBTS' figure of 49,000 years. 49,000 years x 365 = 17,885,000 days. Divide the 21,120,000 by 17,885,000 = movement of OVER ONE FOOT PER DAY to open up the Atlantic Ocean - and that's assuming it actually began opening at the beginning of the Middle Eastern mythology...

    Remember, too, that geologic processes aren't SMOOTH - generally speaking - so the Atlantic would have opened in jumps and starts - that is, if you believe that a Middle Eastern god of a buncha desert-dwelling nomads would actually have a CLUE about the makeup of the ocean - talking to Phoenicians would make more sense if you want to find out about oceans - at least THEY were master sailors...

    Anyhoo, if the mid-Atlantic ridges were moving in jumps and starts, AGAIN you would have had massive earthquakes once every - oh, say, about two weeks. Add to that the massive earthquakes that 'must have been happening' to raise the Himalayas in 6,000 years -

    NO HUMAN CIVILIZATION WOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO DEVELOP. There would have been massive, structure-destroying earthquakes every few days and every few weeks...

    Hamsterbait, the volcanoes active around the perimeters of tectonic plates do not result from 'hot spots' or deep-mantle magma upwelling 'currents'. They generally result from 'subduction' zones where the oceanic plate is being pushed/plunging beneath either other oceanic plates or, more commonly, beneath lighter-weight granitic continental areas. Here is further information on continental shelf/boundary subduction zones and the volcanic activity that results from the oceanic floor plunging beneath the continental body/plates: http://vulcan.wr.usgs.gov/Glossary/PlateTectonics/framework.html

    All of the above explains, to some extent, why I made the comment about "Continental Drift" disproving the bible and the WTBTS' "creation" time schedule on BadBoy's "Venus" thread...

    On a sad side note - the first scientist within recent times to postulate the "Plate Tectonics/Continental Drift" theory was an Icelandic meteorologist who died - froze to death - while trying to obtain further evidence for his theory... : http://academic.emporia.edu/aberjame/histgeol/wegener/wegener.htm

    Zid

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia

    The WT index has this listing (re time dilation):

    speed and time: g68 3/8 19-20; g56 6/8 12-16

    Anyone have access to these articles?

  • VM44
    VM44
    The WT index has this listing (re time dilation):
    speed and time: g68 3/8 19-20; g56 6/8 12-16
    Anyone have access to these articles?

    Yes, I would like to see that article as well!

  • sir82
    sir82

    I always find it hysterical that the Society will accept, without batting an eye, what scientists say about the age of the earth (billions of years) because it fits in with their convoluted interpretation of Genesis (earth created "in the beginning" billions of years ago, prior to the "creative days").

    Yet when the same scientists, using the same methodology, tell us that plants and animals existed hundreds of millions of years ago, "well, that just can't be, science is unreliable, God's word tells us differently, trust in the Bible not science, yadda yadda yadda".

  • VM44
    VM44

    The Watchtower Awake articles from 1968 and 1956 had better NOT question the relationship between speed and time.

    That time slows down as speed increases has been established beyone any doubt, even back in 1956.

    Anyone have those articles? In particular the 1956 one might be hard to obtain.

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia

    Maybe Atlantis might have them.

    I have to wonder if the GA might also have comments on the subject, as it was published closer to the time when relativity was something new.

  • badboy
    badboy

    THE WT SUGGESTS HYPER PLATE TECTONICS AS WELL AS HYPER EVOLUTION IN THE TIME PERIOD SINCE NOAH'S FLOOD

  • BurnTheShips
    BurnTheShips
    WHAT IS JW VIEW ON CONITNENTIAL DRIFT?

    The continents should go to the meetings and out in service regularly, as well as have a regular personal study, or else they will drift away from Jehovah.

  • BizzyBee
    BizzyBee

    Continental Drift - a novel by Russell Banks. "On the extravagant, shallow promises of his brother, Bob Dubois, 30, a burnt-out New Hampshire oil burner repairman, takes his family to Florida."

    I see the WTS having big problems with this story. "Extravagant, shallow promises"? Hoo boy! (Shouldn't be reading novels in the first place.)

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia

    The notion of "hyper plate tectonics" is purely motivated by religious beliefs, not by anything one could learn from science. It would seem that in reality, the JWs are "young earth creationists" after all. The planet is admitted as billions of years old but any actual geological history is strictly located within the very recent past. The uplifting of mountains and the subduction of plates down trenches is placed within a year's time, as these are necessary for the waters to cover land globally at the beginning of the year and for the waters to drain off land at the end of the year.

    To put things into perspective, the 2004 Indian Ocean earthquake was the second most powerful quake ever recorded, 9.3. It produced the most devastating tsunami in recorded history. The plate shifted about 20 meters in this event. That's it. How long does it take a person to walk 20 meters? "Hyper plate tectonics" on the other hand would require plates moving thousands of miles very quickly. This would have, say, the Indian subcontinent move countless times faster than the seafloor pushing it could be laid down at the central and southeast Indian mid-ocean ridges. That the seafloor was laid gradually, of course, can be observed in the record of magnetic field directions in the oxides in the rock, the long string of seamounts, atolls, and islands formed by the mid-Pacific hotspot which show a long-term geologic cycle, the seasonal weathering of uplifted rock (such as the Alps which are worn down as quickly as they are lifted up, largely through spring meltwater from the snowpack), the geologic record of rivers changing courses many times (e.g. the Colorado River used to empty out into Monteray Bay in California where underwater a deep gouge is cut where the river flowed, but back then the Pacific plate was much further south such that the Colorado River used to empty into the ocean at the same latitude and logitude as modern-day Santa Barbara; today it empties into the Gulf of California to the south), etc.

    If, as BadBoy indicates, one wishes to pretend that there was a global flood and those deposits are supposedly part of "Flood" debris, then the Himalayas were uplifted at a rate of 4,838 feet per year, and that's using a figure of 6,000 years ago for the supposed 'occurence of "Noah's" flood'...

    The rate would have to be much higher in fact since you would need to factor in erosion. According to surveys of the Himalayan plateau, a total of 5-9 km of rock was eroded from the Tibetan Himalayas and about 12-25 km from the Higher Himalayas. Compare these figures with the height of Mount Everest, which is only 8.8 km in height. So the height equivalent of one or two Mount Everests have been eroded away throughout the whole plateau as the Himalayas were pushed up. And considering that under normal monsoonal conditions 2.9 mm is eroded away per year, it would take millions of years of weathering to accomplish this feat.

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